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reasonable way, but makes them plethoric, full, the annual collections of which in a single year ex. the Treasury building, and five rented buildings for big, and fair in proportions, shall have work

ceeded three hundred and ten million dollars, and the use of the Department. For the details in regard remitted to him in future, and be able to rise and

must hereafter continue to be large; until our re to the bureaus, I respectfully refer to the reports

ceipts from customs are reluced to $61,000,000 collected from the heads of those bureaus, herewith transinittell us with some exactness how many clerks under specifie rates of duty as in 1860, instead of ted, and should the committee desire any further there are in this bill, what their grades and

$176,000,000 atad valoremrates as at prosent; until our detailed explanation the Department will promptly classes, what their exact compensation ;, so

public debt of $2,500,000,000, iucluding our currency respond.

circulation, is paid off, the accounts of expenditures I beg to call particular attention to the items for that we may vote sums of money demanded by which gave rise to it adjusted, and the current busi administering the internal revenue laws. the public service upon ascertained data. I ness growing out of it terminated. So long must the I transmit herewith a communication under dato think we had better have a general inquiry as

expenses of this Department in nearly every branch of the 28th instant from the Director of the Mint ob

of its operations remain at about their presentstand jecting to the proviso contained on page 41 of the to what has become of the reform bill. I won ard, reduced, of course, from time to time as accumu Lill, lines one thousand aud two to one thousand and der, indeed, that the honorable Senator who lated business is by degrees disposed of. The fact is five inclusive, to which your attention is respectfully

that the accumulations of the wararc not yet cleared called. As the dcductions or profits referred to in gave it bis labor and produced it has not

away notwithstanding our best efforts to this end. this proviso are now paid into the Treasury and aplooked after it and piloted itthrough the mazes In several of the accounting offices especially, the propriated for the incidental expenses of the Mint of senatorial action. These are inquiries that timo of a great nuinber of clerks has been diverted or brunch mint, and are subsequently drawn out on I should like to have answered.

Then our

from this accumulated business to the settlement of the usual requisitions, and the accounts rendered are

bounty claims which pressed upon the Department subject to the supervision of the accounting ofiicers friend from Illinois might be spared the labor under the acts passed since the war, but to carry of the Treasury, I am of the opinion that the legisthat he gives to this subject of finance from

which into effect no additional force was provided lation proposed in the provision referred to is unne

until within a few wceks. time to time, and I do not know that it would

cessary, and will be embarrassing to the operations

It should be remembered, as stated in my former of the Mint. I also transmit a copy of a letter of the not lead generally to better humor all over, as letter, that all public accounts are settled by law at Director of the Mint, inclosing a communication well as better government. I should really like,

the Treasury Department and every dollar of public from the superintendent of the branch mint in San

receipts or expenditures thus passes through it, in Francisco, together with a statement exhibiting the in earnest, to know what has become of the

volving every branch of the Government. Hence its amount of wastage upon gold and silver deposits, great reform bill.

business is increased or diminished by changes in the and the receipts and expenditures of the branch Mr. SHERMAN, I should really like to

business of every other executive branch, but not in mint from its first organization until the present

the same ratio. Local activity in either the State, time, know how to reply to the Senator from Cali.

War, Navy, Post Office, or Interior Departments inay The estimates for the branch mint at San Franfornia ; but I believe I will not enter into any not perhaps extend to any other of those Depart cisco and for the assay office in New York are not extended discussion of this subject. He asks inents; it does extend, however, to the Treasury, and greater at the progent time than for previous years, what has become of a bill referred to the Com.

a slight general activity in all theso other Depart and I see no good reason for reducing the annual

nients produces a comparatively surprising activity appropriations as proposed in the House bill, and I mittee on Finance. I have stated that that at the Treasury Department, where all centre for therefore respectfully recommend, in order that the bill--a very excellent bill—is before the Com

supplies and to which all account. It will therefore operations of these institutions for the current year

be understood that the activity of every branch of mittee on Finance, and has been carefully con

may not be embarrassed, that the usual appropriathe Government during the rebellion, especially tho tion be allowed. sidered by that committee; but it proposes to unparalleled activity ot the War and Navy Depart I have been thus earnest in stating the case, heincrease the compensation of nearly all the

ments, increased enormously the business of this cause if the bill passes in its present coudition

Dopartment, and while it may be possible to bring convinced that thic Treasury Departoient cannot peremployés of the Treasury Department, in order

back at present some of the other Departments to a forun the duties devolved upon it by law during the to make it more efficient, and the Committee comparative peace footing, yet permanent results commng year. on Finance were not disposed to do that at the

remain with us, in paying their debts, and settling With the hope that the views herein expressed and

their bills, which many years will bardly alter. the requests herewith submitted will meet with tho present session of Congress. They did not It seems almost impracticable to determine now approbation of the committee, I have the honor to wish to increase the expenditures of the Treas what should be the exact permanent force of the be, very respectfully, your obedient servant, ury or of any other Department.

HUGH MCCULLOCH,
They thought || Department.
it was better to postpone the reorganization of
The most correct conclusion arrived at is embodied

Secretary of the Treasury.
in the bill now before Congress for the reorganization Hon. JOHN SHERMAN,
this Department until the clerical force could of the Treasury to which I beg respectfully to refer.

Chuirman Senate Finance Committee.
be reduced. That is a sufficient answer to that. In the meantime for the numbers of otiicers, clerks,
&c., and their salaries, I have been unable to reduce

Mr. SHERMAN. The Senate will see from
In fact, I believe the Senator from Maine is

to any very considerable degree our regular esti that letter that this matter has been pretty thorsatisfied with our course; or if not satisfied, at mates. My own idea is that we had better employ oughly inquired into; and I will state to bim in least he did not express his dissatisfaction.

to-day the largest force that can be of advantage on
the back work of the war, because the longerits com-

addition to that, that we have corresponded Now, Mr. President, the Senator from Cali

pletion is put off the more unproductive will be its with every head of bureau in the Treasury fornia no doubt would desire to cast some re results and the weaker the aocountability of public || Department who are, not like the Secretary of proach on the Secretary of the Treasury in

debtors. Hence I cannot recommend so unwiso an finding fault on this subject. I do not think

cconomy in iny judgment, as a decrease in the ac the Treasury, political opponents of ours, but

counting force of the Departinont, or, in fact, of any nearly all of them political friends, and therethat is right. Whether we like the Secretary || branch of it at present, for all are intimately con fore, according to the logic of my friend from of the Treasury or not, he has to administer nected. The persons employed are usefully and, in a great Department of the Government, and I iny judgment, necessarily employed. A reduction

California, he would believe them much inore of their number does not lessen the expenses of the readily. The voluminous communications of believe he administers it honestly, as he con Department in the end; it simply spreads them out

the First Comptroller, the Second Comptroller, ceives. He has no more force now than has

over a longer period, and the result will inevitably
be that the delay will finally cost inore than the ap-

the Commissioner of Customs, the six Auditors,
been employed for years. In order to satisfy
parent, but fictitious momentary saving.

and the Register of the Treasury, are now upon the Senator that we have pretty full informa: To these general remarks I desire to add that I

the table covering every point. In every case tion on the subject, I ask the Senator now to

consider it of vital importance to the successful
listen while a letter is read from the Secretary
working of our independent Treasury system that the

where we could find the slightest reason for a salaries of the officers intrusted with large amounts reduction of their estimates, we have reduced of the 'I'reasury on this very point; but I doubt of public money, exposed in cities-where all are

them ; and if the Senator will look at the bill, very much whether he will listen to it. I ask located--to peculiar temptation, should not be dimin

ished. that the communication which I send to the

he will see that in some cases we have reduced

If called upon to point out the most serious evilat the amounts. Iu regard to this very item, desk be read, and then I will add some further present threatening this system, I should be obliged statements. to answer " the meager compensation of competent

$210,000 were appropriated last year, of which T'he PRESIDING OFFICER, (Mr. Pome:

and responsible ollicers.” It is the old story. Private $60,000 were for the purpose of increasing tem

enterprise offers superior compensation, and we lose porarily the pay of certain employés. That ROY in the chair.) The communication will many of our best men because we cannot pay them be resd, if there be no objection.

was adopted after a long debate. The Comadequately. We have now a case of defalcation in The Chief Clerk read as follows: the courts which probably would not bave occurred

mittee on Finance concluded to drop that and had an adequate salary have been paid by the United only appropriate $150,000 necessary to pay for TREASURY DEPARTMENT, March 31, 1868. States. If the appropriation for additional compen

temporary clerks only; and in regard to that Sir: Respectfully referring to my letter of the 28th

sation under the sub-Treasury system is limited to its
ultimo, I have the honor to submit herewith the re-
present reduced amount by the bill now before you,

item the Secretary of the Treasury, in a letter sult of the reëxamination of the estimates for the

the important office of the United States Assistant dated June 8, says:
support of the Treasury Department during the

Treasurer at New York city will be so crippled there-
ensuing fiscal year, which are now under considera-
by that we shall be unable to continue its business

"If these items are omitted, we shall be obliged to
tion by the Senate Committee on Appropriations in
safely or properly,

discharge one hundred and fifty clerks on or about connection with the pending legislative, executive,

the lst day of July, to the serious injury of the pubI inclose an additional section to the bill continu

lic service."
and judicial appropriation bill, and also by the
Finance Committee.

ing for three years the temporary positions created

for the period during the rebellion and for one year Senators may ask where these one hundred The Department is ignorant of the basis from which thereafter. Besides these, which were established by the calculations of the bill, as it now stands, were

and fifty clerks are employed. They are disspecific provisions of law, there are employés paid made. Our estimates were carefully prepared, and

from appropriations which have for the last few tributed, according to the exigencies of the

years been made in gross amounts for additional in amount, still a sense of duty in the discharge of

service, among the various bureaus. Fortyclerk hire throughout the entire Department. the vast and important trusts devolved by law upon Tbe force paid from these appropriations is used to

two clerks, I believe, are assigned to the this Department restrains me from advising such strengthen any particular branch of the business Second Auditor, and so they are sent from reductions as are comprised in the present bill. No where additional assistance is required, and of necesone appreciates more sensibly than the Secretary the

place to place through the different bureaus. sity varies from time to time. In my judgment, it necessity for economy in the public expenditures,

They are probably now made specially neçespassing as all do in review before him; no one will

cannot yet be dispensed witb.

The estimate for the contingent expenses of the
endeavor
more earnestly to promote this end; but

sary on account of the large amount of work to
to accomplish it he should be provided with proper
Department shows an apparent increase over last

be done on military bounties. I have no doubt year; there is, however, an actual decrease, from the

that after a while they may be dispensed with. There are several considerations which should not

fact that no appropriations are asked for the respectho lost sight of in examining the expenditures of the

ive bureaus as heretofore, but the Department itself * A word now in regard to the bill referred to Troasury Department, and especially in attempting

will take charge of these expenditures, thereby | by the Secretary of the Treasury. That into reduce them, now that the rebellion has ceased, to the amount of the expenditures prior to its com

case in the expenditures for stationery since they creases largely the compensation of the officers were merged under one head.

of the Treasury Department. We did not Reduction upon such a scale is hopeless for many The items in regard to fuel, labor, lights, and mis

think the present a wise time to commence the yours to come, until we can dispense with the inter

cellaneous items for the Treasury buildings are necesnal revenue system, not in existence before the war,

sarily increased on account of the early completion, reorganization of this Department, and there, furnishing, fitting up, and care of the north wing of fore we withheld the bill. If we bad reported

means.

mencement in 1861.

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that bill it would have largely increased the pay

character. But there was nothing said by me The Senator, in a sort of facetions way, to these same employés.

that should induce the honorable ehairman of undertakes to tell the Senate of the United Mr, TRUMBULL. It did not increase the the Committee on Finance to spring to the States that the generous' chairman of the Baaite aggregate. Did it not diminish the number? Secretary's defense. I think that had better | Committee on Appropriations has lent himself Mr. SHERMAN. Perhaps not, for the be left to others to do.

to the purposes of the Treasury Department. officers named, but it would have increased the I am not among those, as suggested by the He does not say that in words; but ihat is the aggregate. At any rate, we thought the un Senator from Ohio, who doubt the truth of substance of it; that out of good nature, ont

des of many questionable effect would be to increase the statements made by political opponents. I of an abundance of generosity, the chairman expenses of the Treasury Department at pres believe there are as honorable and truthful men of the Committee on Appropriations is willing ent, and we did not feel disposed to report it. ranking among my opponents, politically, as to lend himself to the purposes of the Secretary It raised the pay of all the employés, all the there are on the side that I am on ; but I have of the Treasury to deplete the Treasury of the clerks, and all the officers of the Treasury not a very high opinion of the kind of politics United States; to take away its money ; that Department, I think without exception. that I understand to be those of the Secretary | I am willing to make this bill plethoric ; that

Mr. FESSENDEN. Oh, no; that is a great of the Treasury. AsIunderstand him, he took that has been the office and the function Í have minuty mistake.

office and began as a Republican, and as I performed ; that I come here with a bill which Mr. SHERMAN. It is very common to say

understand him now he is not a Democrat. If he would facetiously tell the Senate of the that a particular plan to reorganize a Depart- || I were called upon to describe him I should United States I wished to impose upon the

真 anbe Co ment will decrease the aggregate expense while describe him, and I think the country would country, to take money out of the Treasury ; it is increasing the pay. That always involves agree with me, as a bad Republican merely, so and my honorable friend, with an abundance an absurdity, because if the number of em. bad that he has lost his standing with the party of good nature, seems to enjoy exhibiting me ployés under the new organization is found not that gave him office, and yet holds on to the to the country in that light. Sir, I do not know to be sufficient to do the work they always ask office.

but that the Senate will get that impression, for an increase, and the result is an increased Mr. HOWE. Uncurrent.

I do not know but that I have done something expenditure. That will be the case in regard Mr. CONNESS. Yes, uncurrent; and yet or said something which justifies the impres. to that bill. At any rate that bill is now pend. || he has held on to the oflice. It has been said sion that the chairman of the Committee on ing before the Committee on Finance. We of persons who get high offices particularly that || Appropriations has really been disposed to concluded not to act upon it at this session, | few die and none resign. In my opinion that make this bill plethoric, redundant, overflow simply because it does raise the pay of the officer, when he was unable longer to coöperate | ing with money from the Treasury of the Uniemployés. In lieu of that we have provided as a member of the great Union party of the ted States; and I do not know but that the by another amendment for an increase of the country, through whom he had acquired his Senate of the United States will believe that pay of the Comptrollers and Auditors to a high place, should have in honor laid down his my associates upon the Committee on Approlimited amount.

office. There was only one consideration, per priations have lent themselves to that purpose. Mr. CONNESS. I was not aware that the haps, that could have induced him honorably But I would say to the honorable Senator measure introduced by the honorable Senator to keep it, and that was a conviction that his that all such allusions as that, whether in good from Maine [Mr. FESSENDEN] increased the keeping it was necessary to the safety and honor nature or otherwise, are a gratuity which he compensation of all

the officers in the Treasury. of the country. Nobody would agree with him ought not to feel that I can afford he should On the contrary, I understood that it was to if he were to give that reason; and that could | indulge in ; and however he is entertained by be a great reform, that although it did put up not be the reason why he has held it. I have it, it is a cheap kind of entertainment which I a few salaries of men deserving increased com no opinion, in point of fact, of the politics of do not fancy. He may. When he knows more pensation, it so organized the labor of the those gentlemen who have continued in office about the duties of the Committee on ApproDepartment that the sain total would be less and at the head of Departments under this priations he will have less to say about it; and than is now paid, and would be brought to an Administration who acquired their power by when he understands more of its duties he will ascertained amount. That is what I under professing one class of opinions and then held be in a better condition to enlighten the Senstood. However, the honorable Senator from it by continually violating those opinions. ate upon the particular subject before the Ohio has had it in his charge for a great many So much for politics. The honorable Sen Senate on this proposition. I do not know a months and ought to know.

ator, if I have consumed time upon the subject, great deal about it, but I presume I know more Mr. FESSENDEN. The Senator from Obio is responsible for it, for I did not talk of pol about the clerks and the clerical force of the is entirely mistaken in saying that it increases itics when up before. I simply desired to aid | Treasury Department than the honorable Senthe pay of all the employés. It increases the my friend from Illinois, who always has an eye ator does, or will kpow on that subject, unless pay of comparatively a very small number of to these matters, and who has given a good he addresses himself particularly to it. I do them.

deal of labor to endeavoring to correct abuses not say this, of course, out of any disrespect to Mr. CONNESS. That of course I leave to in the Treasury Department. Guided by his him or to charge him with any want of general be adjusted between the author of the bill and experience and instructed by it, I certainly l information ; but I say it simply that having the chairman of the Committee on Finance. I shall not intrude myself upon ihe Senate much, 1 attended to my particular duty in fixing the supposed that the passage of the bill would be nor attempt to accomplish much public good appropriations for this branch of the service I a great public advantage. If it makes too great for all his efforts thus far, I think, have been am not to be told by that Senator, either in a an advance in the salaries of the employés of vain, or nearly so. However, I hope he will general or special way, that I cannot enlighten the Treasury the Committee on Finance have not grow weary of well doing, but will keep on him upon that subject, and that, therefore, I the privilege of cutting those down and report in the right way and direction.

bave no information on the subject myselfi ing the bill to us.

Mr. MORRILL, of Maine. Mr. Presi Mr. President, I undertake to say that the But, Mr. President, I rose more to say that dent

Committee on Appropriations have made this the honorable Senator was not authorized by The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Chair || appropriation bill as it came from the comanything I had said to describe me as simply will remind Senators that the question is on mittee in conformity to the law, we have prowishing to make an attack on the Secretary of the amendment moved by the Senator from vided for the service demanded by the law; the Treasury; and I take it he only did it to Ohio.

and when the Senator from California undergive himself an opportunity to spring to that Mr. MORRILL, of Maine. I am well aware takes to criticise our report he had better official's defense. I certainly made no attack of that. I do not rise to continue the debate, examine and see where the short coming is. upon him. I did not name him. I said we but simply to express my admiration of the

If he says we are depleting the Treasury, let were considering unascertained appropriations; manner in which the honorable Senator from him look at the bill and see where we propose that there was inexactness about them, and California comes to the rescue of, or to back to draw a dollar out of the Treasury not author; that was confessed; that I had just listened to up, the Senator from Illinois.

If he had not

ized by the statutes of the United States. I a speech from the honorable Senator who has sat down with the statement that that was his | undertake to say to that Senator and to the this bill in charge who said he could not state object, nobody could misunderstand the course Senate that the bill as it came from the comanything about it under certain heads. Now, of his remarks so as to suppose that he could mittee authorizes nothing for the Treasury sir, I do not think-and I wish to say that have had any desire or purpose to enlighten the Department or any other Department of the while I am up-that the Secretary of the Treas Senate upon the subject matter before it, for Government, except what is not only justified ury is one of the worst of men-far from it. I he has made no attempt at that.

but demanded by the public service, do not think that he is the best fitted for that The Senator, on rising to reply to some re Mr. TRUMBULL. This amendment that office in this country by far. But I never have marks that I had submitted to the Senate, had we are discussing did not come from the Com. assailed that officer to any extent; certainly the grace to say that he had received no light || mittee on Appropriations. never as much as I felt like doing, and felt at all from the chairman of the Committee on Mr. MORRILL, of Maine. No, sir; and I that he deserved. I have been of the opinion Appropriations. That, I have no doubt, is had tried to make a distinction between the that that practice here is not very well timed, altogether my fault. I was in hopes that the labors of the Committee on Appropriations and that it perhaps had better not be followed; || honorable Senator himself would be luminous and the labors which we deemed belonged 10 that it produces no great public good. My own on this subject and would give the Senate some the Committee on Finance; but I could not opinion is that those engaged in carrying on light. If the Senate really have received any enlighten my honorable friend from California greut Departments of the Government ought light upon the question as to whether an in

on that subject; and so I succeeded in getting to have the confidence of the people; and when crease of the clerical force of the several I liave felt from time to time like criticising Departments is really necessary to the service

the compliment of a willingness to deplete the

Treasury, ont of a generosity which in this the head of the Treasury Department I have of the country or not from the remarks of

respeet the honorable Senator knows as well restrained myself by considerations of this

the honorable Senator I shall be very glad. as anybody would not be public virtue by any

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means. Sir, is it an iininaterial matter that al pass without making it appear to be so infinit- shire; and that is whether there was any auSenator of the United States, chairman of the esimally small. But, sir, it is a good and a thority of law already existing for the appointCommittee on Appropriations, feels that it is | happy conclusion that I have arrived at, that ment of those additional number of more than an act of generosity that he may draw millions with the honorable chairman at the bead of one bundred ladies and thirteen gentlemen in out of the Treasury; and does the Senator that committee, in all that relates to his legiti-l that office. think he pays me a compliment when be says mate duties always well informed, there is not Mr. PATTERSON, of New Hampshire. I that of my generosity I make a bill plethoric | so much necessity for myself and others being would prefer to refer that question to the chairof millions from the Treasury? I do not up. particularly and exactly informed; but the hon man of the Committee on the Judiciary. derstand the compliment in that way. It is a orable Senator should have had no blame for Mr. TRUMBULL. The chairman of the left-handed compliment.

restating here what he said himself, that of | Committee on the Judiciary does not have Now, sir, all I did say, and all I meant to certain matters comprehended by this bill and jurisdiction of the Treasury Department by say on that subject, was that the Committee on the pending amendment he did not know any- any means. He has been very unsuccessful, Appropriations made this appropriation bill in thing, or did not know much. That was what as the Senator from California has said, in conformity to the statutes. We provided for I understood from him.

trying to check any of these abuses, if there the service according to the law, and where we I desired also to do what I have done, call are abuses. found uo law to authorize it we turned it over attention to the attempt to reform this whole Mr. PATTERSON, of New Hampshire. I to the Committee on Finance, which is the service with a view of having it kept in mind should say that I understand that the gentleorgan of the Treasury Department, to provide and brought up at an early day, and with what man himself who holds the office is illegally in for that temporary service which lies outside I said I am entirely content.

his place. of the law; and that is what the chairman of The PRESIDING OFFICER. The ques Mr. TRUMBULL. I was about to state that committee is attempting to do now. How lion is on the amendment of the Senator from that I had heard it said privately on the floor far he ought to go I said I did not know, | Ohio.

of the Senate since this debate commenced because it was not a subject which we had Mr. TRUMBULL. I ask for the yeas and | that the head of one of the bureaus or divisions investigated ; but I do know this-I suppose nays.

in the Treasury Department had stated not we all know who are tolerably well informed The yeas and nays were ordered.

very long ago that he had more clerks than he in regard to the public service--that outside of Mr. TRUMBULL. I will state in a word | knew what to do with. the clerks provided and specifically authorized | what this amendment is, as I have called for Mr. MORRILL, of Vermont. He probably by statutes we have been for several years the yeas and nays upon it.

said that to some one who applied for a place. authorizing, by appropriating a general sum It is a proposition to appropriate $150,000 Mr. TRUMBULL. I do not know whether $300,000 in 1866, $210,000 last year--the em to be expended by the Secretary of the Treas- | anybody applied to get a new clerk. I havo ployment of temporary clerks upon the idea ury, in his discretion, in employing what are not been in the habit of applying for new clerks. that they might not be wanted more than a called temporary clerks, which he is to classify || I think it not unlikely that if Senators would year. Last year, probably, it was hoped that in his discretion, and that means, I suppose, speak out there would be evidence that that $210,000 would employ all the temporary || that he is to pay them according to different is the condition of things in some of the divisclerks necessary, and that this year we should classes, as he shall judge they deserve. A || ions or bureaus of the Treasury Department. pot want any ; but the Senator from Ohio, who similar appropriation, under a different name, I happen to know of one case of the clerk who has charge particularly of matters of finance, has been made for several years. I think, from came to me, who was apprehensive because the who is the organ of that Department, tells you what I have been informed to-day, the appro- || business bad fallen off that he would lose his that now they want a portion of the temporary priation was $210,000 last year; and before place. I do not propose to take up time in force continued to the extent that will be that it was some three hundred thousand dol- | regard to this matter. I wish to record my allowed by an appropriation of $150,000. Ilars, which was distributed by the Secretary | vote against appropriations of this kind.

Mr. FESSENDEN. I think this question cise question I do not undertake to instruct the Department, in part by increasing their sala. || is a very simple one. I wish the Senate to Senate; and if my honorable friend from Cal ries and giving to such as he thought proper | understand it, and then of course they will do ifornia is not instructed on the subject I am an increased compensation. We once had here as they please about it. not at fault about that. I did not undertake a report from the officers of the Department For several years during the war, by acts of to instruct him, but I did undertake to tell him as to how it was distributed. Now, I think it il Congress, we went on increasing the force in what we had done; and when he says to me is about time that we stopped appropriating the Treasury Department. In addition to that and the Senate that I shed no light on this money at the rate of $150,000 at a time, to be for some years past we have been in the habit, subject, if that is what he means, I take no placed in the hands of any officer of this Govern on the recommendation of the Secretary of the offense.

ment, to be used in his discretion in this way. Treasury, of giving a certain amount to be used I said when up before that I did know, in I know but little about the clerks in these for the employment of temporary clerks. It regard to the Second Comptroller's office, that | Departments, but little of the necessity for the began under Mr. Chase, and has been conthere was a force now actually employed there number that are employed; but it has come to tinued since. The matter has been discussed to the extent of forty-three clerks, which we my knowledge within a few days, in a single here, I think, every year, and every year the had not undertaken to provide for. Those instance, that a clerk has applied to me, stat necessity of the thing has been made apparent. clerks were paid last year out of what is called ing that the work in the particular branch of There are at this moment in the Treasury a lapsed fund, and it is exhausted, as I am the Department where he was engaged was Department-not all here, but some at the subtold. Now, whether the Senate of the United falling off, and he was very much afraid that Treasurer's office in New York, and some, I States think that those forty-three clerks can he would be discharged because there was no suppose, in other offices where they are actually be dispensed with from the Second Comptrol work to do, and he wanted me to interfere in needed-one hundred and fifty or one hundred ler's office, is a question for them to judge. || bis behalf if I could, to try and have him put and sixty temporary clerks, most of whom are The Secretary of the Treasury says do. The somewhere where he would be retained. Il absolutely essential to the transaction of the chairman of the Committee ou Finance, whose know very little about these clerks; it is very business of the Department. If you refuse to duty it is to know whether it is so or not, thinks seldom that I make any recommendations in appropriate this $150,000 of course the emyou cannot afford it; the public service will | any of the Departments. I presume that the ployment of those clerks must stop; a very suffer if it is done. I have no more right to case I have just mentioned is not a single one, considerable number of whom the various Asexpress any other opinions than other

gen

but that there are many other like cases. In: Il sistant Treasurers at New York have severally tleman whose duty it is not to inquire into deed, I have heard it said to-day privately said are absolutely essential to the conduct of

Mr. PATTERSON, of New Hampshire, Il business in that office must be dispensed with. Mr. CONNESS. Mr. President, but for the should like to ask a question.

So to a less extent in Philadelphia, and so in fear that it would spoil a very excellent speech Mr. TRUMBULL. Very well.

the Treasury Department proper here. You that we have heard from the honorable Sena Mr. PATTERSON, of New Hampshire. I must either provide by law for the employment tor from Maine, I should have corrected him want to ask the gentleman if this $150,000 of these clerks, and thus make them legal, or some time ago by stating that he has totally will be sufficient? I ask the question for this you must appropriate money to allow them to misunderstood what I intended to say; and

reason : the Committee on Retrenchment had beemployed temporarily, and leave it to the Seccertainly I must think that he did not listen occasion to call upon the Register of the retary of the Treasury to expend that money, with care to what I did say. I understood him Treasury to know how many additional ap or you must dismiss the clerks, to confess that in regard to these temporary pointments had been made in his Department

Mr. TRUMBULL. This appropriation does clerks he knew nothing and could state noth since he entered upon its duties; and we not contemplate paying clerks at New York or ing; and that I think was about how I put it. found that there had been thirteen gentlemen Philadelphia. But the honorable Senator holds me responsi- and one hundred and seventeen ladies, their Mr. FESSENDEN.

Yes, it does. ble for representing to the Senate and tie coun pay involving an expenditure of $9,100 per Mr. TRUMBULL. It comes in under "intry that he is an extravagant organ of the Cominonth, which would be $109,200 per year |cidental and contingent expenses of the Treasmittee on Appropriations.

Now, sir, I do not under that gentleman alone, simply in the ury Department." believe that. I did not say that I could not Register's ofice. I wish to suggest to the Sen Mr. FESSENDEN. Very well; that is part

ator that if the other bureaus have increased | of the Treasury Department. As to my knowledge of this subject I do not in the same proportion, this appropriation Mr. TRUMBULL. There are other appro. profess a great deal.

What I knew on it I ought to be a million instead of $150,000. priations for them. stated. If that was little, the honorable Sen Mr. TRUMBULL. I should like to ask a Mr. HOWE. They are appropriated for ator might have been content to have let that ll question now of the Senator from New Hamp- l separately.

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Mr. FESSENDEN. Many of them are, and of the Treasury to ask for a larger force than of the recommendation of the Secretary of the many are not. They are scattered all over he needs and for the appropriation of more Treasury, and in the face of the action of the wherever clerks are needed for the business money than he can expend with advantage to Committee on Finance, who have examined it, of the Treasury Department, as I understand. the Government? Does he spend it on his he can do so. But I really do think, with all Is not that so?

own person? Can he withdraw it or use it for | respect to the honorable Senator from Illinois, Mr. SHERMAN. This appropriation is for any other purpose than that for which it is that when the Secretary of the Treasury tells additional clerical force in the 'l'reasury De appropriated ? What does he want it for? you they are necessary, and when the Compartment, but I suppose they mig be assigned Does he want to in the reputation of being mittee on l'inance bave examined the matter to duty elsewhere.

a very extravagant man in the administration and tell you this provision is necessary, it is Mr. FESSENDEN. I know that additional of the Department? Granting that he is as quite as good as the proof which the Senator force was called for in the sub-Treasurer's faulty as the honorable Senator from Illinois adduces on his side, to wit, that somebody, a office in New York, and the persons employed thinks he is, what inducement in the world has clerk, came to him and told him that in bis were paid out of this fund at one time, he to employ more people there than he has particular place the business was falling off Whether it is so now or not I do not know, work for I should like to know. Why does and he was afraid he would lose his office. but I presume it to be so. At any rate, here he want to swell the number of clerks in the There is one of his proofs against the Secrewe have it; they are employed, and they are, Department? Why does he want money appro tary of the Treasury and the Committee on as the Secretary of the Treasury says, neces. priated for the purpose of paying these extra Finance! Another is, that somebody around sarily employed. There is no law authorizing clerks if he has not got business for them to the Senate here says that in one of the bureaus, their employment permanently. Then what I do? He comes here and says, “I want so I do not know which, the business is not so will you do? You must either dismiss them many clerks," and he tells you the reason why / great as it used to be. Is that enough to make altogether or make an appropriation to pay he wants them; and the Senator from Illinois, out a case? I appeal to my honorable friend them. The Senate can decide whether it will without knowing a thing of what is done there, as a judge whether he will udmit such sort of take the responsibility of saying that these one says this is astonishing! I do not pretend to evidence as going to prove anything in any hundred and fifty or one hundred and sixty know much about it; but I know what was court except the Senate. I apprebend we may clerks shall be dismissed. If the Senate refuse needed at one time when I was there, and I with safety do wbat is recommended by the to make the appropriation, of course they will presume the same thing is needed now. Committee on Finance after they have exam. take the responsibility of whether the business If we do not choose to put into the Secre ined the subjeet. of the Department is done or not.

So far as

tary's hands $150,000 for temporary clerks, Mr. RAMSEY. I move that the Senate do I am concerned, I do not care a sixpence how let the business stop, or else pass a law pro now adjourn. It is half past four o'clock, the Senate decide it. I have always voted for viding how many cierks shall be employed and and there is no probability of getting a yote the appropriation because I knew its necessity, make the necessary appropriation; but that to-night.

A word now in reference to a bill which has not been thought to be wise, because when Mr. TRUMBULL. I hope the Senator will
has been alluded to that I brought in and had you pass such a law they become permanent, withdraw that motion for a moment. I wish
referred to the Committee on Finance. It was and you have to pass another law to get rid of to correct a statement of the Sepator from
a bill reorganizing the Treasury Department. them, but when you simply provide from year Maine in regard to these clerks.
It makes the aggregate amount of salaries paid to year temporarily for them the moment they Mr. RAMSEY. Very well; I withdraw the
somewhat more than they are now, but $200,000 are not needed their services can be dispensed motion.
less than they are now with the twenty per cent. with. That is the reason this appropriation Mr. TRUMBULL. Mr. President, the Sen-
added, which we gave last year, and which we has been made in this form from time to time. ator from Maine (Mr. FESSENDEN] seems to
are called upon to give again.' Undoubtedly The Senator asks, why put $150,000 in the suppose that there is a necessity for clerks in
the salaries ought to be raised, or we ought to Secretary's hands to increase the pay of clerks? | Philadelphia and in New York, and he urges
give some percentage to a considerable por If the Senator had troubled himself to know that as one of the reasons why this appropria-
tion of the clerks. That bill gets rid of this what he was talking about, he would know that tion should pass. There are some things we
twenty per cent. business by reorganizing the the amendment did not do any such thing. can know without being in the Treasury De-
Department, raising a portion of the salaries, Mr. TRUMBULL. This provision is that partment, and if he had looked at this bill he
and transferring men from one class into he may classify them in his discretion.

would have found that it came from the House
another. I know as well as I know anything Mr. FESSENDEN. Classify them, but not of Representatives with this clause:
that a considerable portion of the men in that pay them extra. Does not the Senator under-

For salaries of clerks, messengers, and watchmen Departmentare paid much less than they ought stand the difference between classifying and in the ofice of the Assistant Treasurer at New York, to receive, while a very considerable proportion paying extra?

$60,000. get all that they earn, and perhaps more too.

Mr. SHERMAN. The same provision bas There is a nice little sum, but that was not half I think, for instance, that the first and second been in the law for eight years.

enough, and in the Senate our Committee on class clerks who have families cannot support Mr. FESSENDEN. We have made the Appropriatious proposed to raise that $60,000 their families with what they get, but I think provision for years in the same language, and which was in the House bill to $126,000, wore that young men, those who have no families, last year there was in the appropriation a clause that double what the House proposed, for the can get along very well with $1,200, and ought | authorizing a part of the money to be used for benefit of the Assistant Treasurer's ollice in not to have any more. But whether any dis increasing the compensation of clerks; but New York; and I believe the amount was still tinction can be made or not it is for Congress that is struck off this year, and $60,000 of the further increased on the suggestion of the Comto decide. I stated at the time I offered that appropriation is struck off with it.' I believe mittee on Fiuance. Now $150,000 more is probill that I thought some of the salaries pro it would be wise to keep in that provision posed to be added, and one of the reasons given vided for in it were too high. I did not draft | still; but the Committee on Finance think it is that more clerks may be wanted at New the bill. It was drafted at the Treasury De. best to leave it off, and of course I yield to York, partment. I looked it over and I approved its their decision. Last year the appropriation

Mr. FESSENDEN. I wish to show the Sen. general scope, and I stated when I had it was $210,000, and in that appropriation it was ator that he does not understand it at all. My referred to the Committee on Finance that I provided that the Secretary was to use the colleague explained it once to him, and told considered some of the salaries too high, but money for two purposes; in the first place, to him that all the appropriations to which he that could be corrected. The general idea of employ extra clerks, and in the next place to now refers were made to meet the service prothe bill is a good one.

raise the pay of certain clerks. This year an vided for by law. The House of RepreseataNow, sir, with reference to the fact stated by appropriation of $150,000 is proposed instead tives bave gone back to the time before the the honorable Senator from New Hampshire, of $210,000, and the only way in which the war, and our committee have brought it up. it is undoubtedly true that in the Register's office money can be used is to hire extra clerks. It | This $150,000 is for extra clerks in those very there has been a very large recent increase of is also provided that the Secretary may classify | offices, as well as in the Department here. force. What is the reason of it? The reason them; that he may put one into the fourth What I stated is perfectly correct. is that there is a very large arrear of business, class, another into the third, another into the Mr. TRUMBULL. I supposed this increase business which must be disposed of. The office second, and another into the first. That is was for clerks that were not provided for by is getting behindhand on the coupons and other very proper, for he wants different kinds of law, but I was showing that the bill provided things that come in there. That oflice has now men for different work. He wants some men $126,000 for clerks at New York, soinething more work to do than it has people to do it for some work that cannot be performed by of a sum; and that this $150,000 might box with, but it cannot provide room for those men who would suffer themselves to be enn possibility not be necessary there. As the Reeded in order to do it. It is not a mere ployed for $1,200. That is a matter of discre House had started with $60,000, and the Senaappointment of people without wanting them; tion with him. Will you leave no discretion ate bad given $126,000, I supposed it was posthey are needed. They will not be needed for with the Secretary of the Treasury?

sible that would answer the purpose. a long period of time. Probably a year or less The question is a very simple one, and it is But the Senator from Maine says that as than a year will bring up this arrear of busi for the Senate to decide. At this period of ness, so that a large portion of them can be the session I suppose you must do either one

faulty as the Secretary of the Treasury may be dispensed with, but at the present time they of two things: either give this money or dis

supposed to be by the Senator from Illinois,

what object has he in employing more clerks are absolutely needed on account of the con miss the men, and take the responsibility of dition of the work of that office. having the business of the Department so far had not said a word about the Secretary of the

than are necessary? The Senator from Illinois Gentlemen argue as if the Secretary of the interrupted. If any Senator thinks it is best Treasury being faulty. I have no difference Treasury had some personal interest in this to have it interrupted, and that without this matter. What inducement has the Secretary provision there are clerks enough, in the face || appropriation about which I am speaking. It

with the Secretary of the Treasury. It is the

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is possible, Mr. President, that a Secretary of that $210,000? I am told by a member of the linghuysen, Harlan, McDonald, Pomeroy, Stewart, the Treasury, I do not say the Secretary of the other House, who received his information Suinner, Thayer, Tipton, Wade, and Wilson-13.

ABSENT- Messrs. Anthony, Buckalew, Cattell, Treasury, but it is possible that a Secretary of from the Treasury Department itself in explan Chandler, Drake. Edmunds Ferry, Grimes, Hen. the Treasury, may have favorites as well as ation of another thing, that about one hundred derson, Howard, Johnson, Morrill of Maine, Morrill other men. It is possible he may have human and ten or one hundred and twenty thousand of Vermont, Morton, Norton, Nye, Rice, Saulsbury, frailties as well as other men, and that there dollars was devoted to the pay of temporary

Vickers, and Willey--20. may be favorite persons around him that he clerks, and that the rest of this money was

So the motion was agreed to. would like to give employment to, and whose distributed upon the direction of the Secretary The PRESIDENT pro tempore. The Sensalaries he would like to increase.

of the Treasury, $1,000 or $1,500 being given | ate stands adjourned until tomorrow at two But the Senator from Maine wants to know in every instance to the head of a bureau, all of o'clock. if the Senator from Illinois does not know the whom I am told received it except one, and difference between classifying clerks and pay. these additions thus conferred by the favor of HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES. ing them extra. I supposed that by classify. || the Secretary ranged from one thousand to

WEDNESDAY, June 24, 1868. ing these clerks he meant paying one $1,800 | fifteen hundred dollars. In that way about sixty and another $1,200, and thatis done under the percent. of the money having been devoted to the The House met at twelve o'clock m. Prayer name of classification. It is possible that a employment of temporary clerks the financial | by the Chaplaio, Rev. C. B. Boynton. person less pure, having fewer human frailties officer of the Government inanaged to get rid The Journal of yesterday was read and than the present Secretary of the Treasury has, of the residue. That residue, in charity to the approved. might go into that office and might desire that Treasury, is not included in this amendment,

IMPRISONMENT OF WARREN AND COSTELLO. a favorite person should be so classified as to and when it prevails we may console ourselves

The SPEAKER laid before the House, by get $1,800, when another clerk just as good by remembering that here is a clear gain of practically was so classified as to get only

unanimous consent, the following message from sixty or seventy or eighty thousand dollars,

the President of the United States: $1,200. I can conceive that that would be looking to the past, whichever the precise possible with other persons than the Secretary amount may be. I shall vote against it.

To the House of Representatives : of the Treasury.

Mr. RAMSEY. I move that the Senate do

I transinit a report from the Secretary of State, in

answer to a resolution of the Ilouse of RepresentaMr. RAMSEY. I hope the Senator from now adjourn.

tives of the 15th instant, upon the subject of Messrs. Illinois will now give way. He has made a suffi Mr. CAMERON. Before that motion is Warren and Costello, who have been convicted and cient explanation. put, I wish the Senator from Minnesota to allow sentenced to penal imprisopinentin Great Britain.

ANDREW JOIINSON. Mr. TRUMBULL. I give way to the Sena me to make a motion.

WASHINGTON, June 23, 1868. tor from Minnesota.

Mr. RAMSEY. I withdraw the motion. Mr. RAMSEY. I renew my motion to Mr. CAMERON. Just a moment. I wish

The message and accompanying report were

referred to the Committee on Foreign Affairs, adjourn. to move a reconsideration of the vote which

and ordered to be printed. Mr. SHERMAN. I hope the Senator will adjourned the Senate until two o'clock toallow us to finish this amendment. Let us take morrow.

DIMINUTION OF THE ARMY. the vote, because I want to be absent to-mor The PRESIDENT pro tempore. It is moved The SPEAKER also laid before the House row at one o'clock.

that the vote by which the Senate agreed to a communication from the Secretary of War, Mr. RAMSEY. I will withdraw the motion meet to-morrow at two o'clock be reconsid- transmitting a statement of the estimated dimif there is a possibility of a vote immediately ; ered.

inution of the Army by various causes up to otherwise not.

Mr. SPRAGUE. I hope not.

January 1, 1869, and to July 1 of the same The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Sena Mr. CONNESS called for the yeas and nays; year; which was referred to the Committee on tor from Minnesota withdraws his motion. and they were ordered.

Military Affairs, and ordered to be printed. Mr. SHERMAN. I desire to submit a priv. Mr. CAMBRON. I desire to say that I can

RECONSTRUCTION EXPENSES. ileged motion. I move that when the Senate see no good reason for adjourning until two

The SPEAKER also laid before the House adjourns to-day it adjourn to meet at two o'clock o'clock to-morrow different from any other to-morrow; Senators understand the reason. day. I am perfectly willing, if Senators think

a communication from the Secretary of War, The PRESIDING OFFICER. The motion it wise, that we shall meet every evening at six

transmitting a communication from the Pay. can be entertained if there be no objection. o'clock and sit the whole night to do so. 1 master General, submitting estimates of the The motion was agreed to. think in warm weather it would be better; but

amount required for deficiencies in the approThe PRESIDING OFFICER. The ques

I do not think we should adjourn till a late hour priations for the execution of the reconstruction is on the amendment of the Senator from to-morrow for a special object, because some

tion acts for the balance of the present fiscal Ohio, upon which the yeas and nays have been of us have been invited to a wedding; let me

year, with an estimate for the next fiscal year; ordered. speak out plainly; I was trying to find some

which was referred to the Committee on Appro. Mr. CATTELL. I only want a single min.

other word. It is hardly fair that the Senate priations, and ordered to be printed. ute to say that, as a member of the Finance of the United States, so near the termination

ARKANSAS MEMBERS. Committee, I felt it my duty personally to call

of the session, should adjourn to go to a wed Mr. SCOFIELD. I rise to submit a priviat the Treasury Department in regard to this ding like a parcel of young boys. We are old | leged report from the Committee of Elections. item now under consideration ; that iny informmen, or ought to be. It was supposed when

The committee bave carefully examined the ation was obtained from Mr. Hartley, the

this body was provided for that it would con credentialsAssistant Secretary, at a personal interview, tain aged, prudent, and wise men.

Mr. BROOKS. I rise to a question of and that he brought into my presence several

young myself; but there are many old men order. On the 15th of this month the House of the heads of bureaus and divisions, and

here, and I think all the old men at least would adopted the following resolution : satisfied me conclusively that this sum was abbe better employed in attending to their duties

Resoloed, That after the report of the tax bill by solutely necessary to the working of the Treas

here than in going to a wedding to-inorrow. the Committee of Ways and Means in pursuance of ury Departmeht.' Upon that information, thus

Besides, there is no particular reason why the order just passed, no other business shall be in

order but the consideration of the bill so reported by obtained on my own personal application to the this body should adjourn to go to the wedding

said committee, except reports from the Committee Department, I voted in the Finance Committee of anybody, and, as is suggested to me by the on Enrolled Bills.' in favor of reporting this amendment, and I

Senator from California, (Mr. Conness,] it In giving construction to that order, the

never has been done in the history of the Sen Speaker said: Mr. CONKLING. I shall vote against this ate. I do not think there is any special reason

*This resolution only cxccpts the reports of the amendment, and I shall do it with full con

why we should go to the wedding of the Sena Committee on Enrolled Bills. There are two cases sciousness of the futility of doing so.

The
tor who is to be married to-morrow. He is beside, arising under the Constitution of the United

States, which the llouse cannot exclude. One is the Treasury Department having made this requi. not the first man who was married, and I trust

veto of the President of the United States." sition, I take it for granted, for the purpose of

he is not the last who will be. Let us come this remark, that it is to be answered by the here at our regular hour and perform our duties

"The other case is where a member claims the

right to be siyorn in from any State where there has Senate, and I rise for the purpose of saying as we ought to do. If any of the Senators have

been legislation." that if it shall be adopted we shall have some a special desire to go to this wedding let them

The SPEAKER. The Chair will correct cause of consolation, I think, in the fact it is

go, and those of us who remain here will attend not $210,000, and that it does not involve all

the gentleman right at this point. The reto our duties as well as we can. I hope we the latitude of discretion which last year and

porter of the Globe did not hear correctly what shall reconsider the vote.

the Speaker said. The Chair has here, in a the year before was committed to the Secretary

Mr. TRUMBULL. I move that the Senate

corrected form, the correct statement of what adjourn.

he said, as follows: And now I want to make one single remark,

Mr. CONNESS. On that motion I call for to which I ask the attention of Senators. Last || the yeas and nays.

"The other case is where a member claims the

right to be sworn in from any State in regard to year the language of the act, as it appears in

The yeas and nays were ordered ; and being which there has been recent legislation.”

taken, resulted----yeas 23, nays 13; as follows: Those are the words which the Speaker “And provided further, That the Secretary may award such additional compensation to officers and

YEAS-Messrs. Bayard, Cole, Conkling, Corbett, | used, as the House will remember. clerks as in his judgment may be deemed just and

Davis, Dixon, Doolittle, Fessenden, Fowler, Hend Mr. BROOKS. And the Speaker goes on may be required by the public service.” ricks, Howe, McCreery, Morgan, Patterson of New

to say: Hampshire, Patterson of Tennessee, Ramsey, Ross, And opposite that is the item of $210,000.

Sherman, Sprague, Trumbull, Van Winkle, Wile "The question may be referred to a committee; it

liams, and Yates-23. Now, what do Senators suppose was done with

may be postponed, but it must come before the NAYS-Messrs. Caneron, Connoss, Cragin Fre House."

I am very

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shall vote for it now.

of the Treasury.

the estimates, was:

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