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Thursday,]

ABSENT — ALLEY.

[July 14th.

[blocks in formation]

Abbott, Alfred A. Jackson, Samuel
Allen, Parsons

Jacobs, John Atwood, David C. Jenks, Samuel H. Ball, George S. Kellogg, Martin R. Banks, Nath'l P., Jr. Keyes, Edward L. Bartlett, Russel

Langdon, Wilber C. Bartlett, Sidney Little, Otis Beach, Erasmus D. Loomis, E. Justin Beebe, James M. Meader, Reuben Bell, Luther V. Mixter, Samuel Bennett, Zephaniah Monroe, James L. Bigelow, Jacob Packer, E. Wing Bronson, Asa

Park, John G. Brown, Adolphus F. Parker, Samuel D. Brown, Hiram C. Parris, Jonathan Bullen, Amos H. Payson, Thomas E. Chapin, Henry Peabody, George Clark, Salah

Perkins, Daniel A. Clarke, Stillman Perkins, Jonathan C. Cressy, Oliver S.

Pierce, Henry Crosby, Leander Powers, Peter Crowell, Seth

Read, James Cutler, Simeon N. Richards, Luther Davis, Robert T. Ring, Elkanah, Jr. Dawes, Henry L. Rockwell, Julius DeWitt, Alexander Sampson, George R. Dorman, Moses Sheldon, Luther Durgin, John M. Sherman, Charles Easton, Jan 2d Simmons, Perez Eaton, Calvin D. Souther, John Gardner, Henry J. Spooner, Samuel W. Gardner, Johnson Stetson, Caleb Gooch, Daniel W. Stevenson, J. Thomas Gooding, Leonard Strong, Alfred A. Gould, Robert

Stutson, William Goulding, Jason Sumner, Increase Greene, William B. Swain, Alanson Hall, Charles B. Taber, Isaac C. Haskell, George Talbot, Thomas Heywood, Levi Thomas, John W. Hobart, Aaron Thompson, Charles Hobart, Henry Tilton, Abraham Hooper, Foster Tower, Ephraim Hopkinson, Thomas Train, Charles R. Houghton, Samuel Tyler, John S. Howland, Abraham H. Underwood, Orison Hunt, Charles E. Wallace, Frederick T. Huntington, Charles P Whitney, Daniel S. Huntington, George H. Wilbur, Daniel Hyde, Benjamin D. Williams, Henry Ide, Abijah M., Jr. Wood, Nathaniel

Absent and not voting, 102.

Personal Explanation. Mr. ALLEY, of Lynn. I rise, Sir, for the purpose of asking the indulgence of the Convention to make a personal explanation.

The PRESIDENT. If no objection be made, the gentleman will be at liberty to proceed.

The Chair understands that no objection is made.

Mr. ALLEY, of Lynn. Mr. President, it was my purpose to have remained silent in relation to the unprovoked attack upon me, which was made the other day by the gentleman from Boston, (Mr. Hillard). I have always recognized the wisdom of the advice of Chesterfield to his son: “ That he should never notice an insult; for no gentleman will insult you, and no one else can." I have been informed that it was the purpose, or desire, of that gentleman, to have the remarks which he made the other day suppressed from the records ; but I notice in one of the daily papers of this morning, a full report of that gentleman's speech, revised and corrected, I presume, by himself, in which occurs this language :

“ The gentleman from Lynn, (Mr. Alley,) the other day, upon this text, discharged at me a small pellet of something that tried to be sarcasm, but could not. The report of his pop-gun was so faint that I do not think it was heard by half the Convention. Indeed, nothing but a respect for the decorum of the place, prevented me from calling out encore ! I thought it selfish to be amused by an exhibition in which so few participated.”

Mr. President: In view of this publication, and finding that some misapprehension exists with regard to the occasion of that attack, I feel it is due to myself to say a few words of explanation. In the first place, I would remark, that I was not present when the attack was made. In what I have to say, my purpose is not to return railing for railing, for I speak more in sorrow than in anger. Permit me to say, that I have been associated in legislative halls and deliberative assemblies, in the counting-room and in the workshop, with men of every degree, calling, and profession, and this is the first time in my life that I have ever been so grossly assailed. It is inexplicable to me why I should be attacked by one who has occupied so high a position in social and literary life-an individual some ten years my senior -one to whom I never spoke in my life but once, and then only a few words upon matters of busi

When I consider, Sir, that the attack was made upon one whom the gentleman evidently supposed had not the power of repelling it, I have no language adequate to the expression of the sentiments of my heart. I have made no extend

ness.

So the Report of the Committee was concurred in and the resolves were ordered to a second reading

Thursday,]

ALLEY - HILLARD.

[July 14th.

ed remarks in this Convention but once, and then to be assailed with such severity of criticism, reponly in obedience to the call of duty.

resenting, as I do, so modest a class as the practiIn attempting to speak before this Convention cal business men of the community. I have lived under any circumstances, I feel very much, as I long enough to value men for their deeds, rather doubt not many others do in this body, who are, than for their words. I am too much occupied like me, men of acts rather than of words—that with the cares and perplexities of other and more it is complete martyrdom. A few days after I congenial avocations, to spend a great deal of time had the honor to address the Convention, the in preparing speeches. That gentleman has lived gentleman from Cambridge, misapprehending my long enough, and has studied history often remarks, ascribed to me sentiments which I did enough, to know that great results are seldom not utter, and it was only for the purpose of put- achieved by mere rhetoricians. Edmund Burke ting myself right upon the record, that I occupied once said that the graces of oratory and solidity of just two minutes, as appears by the record of the judgment are seldom combined in the same indichairman at the time, in making an explanation vidual. Another great writer has said: “Give of my views. Upon that occasion, I simply allud- me, to found an empire, or raise a nation, the ed, without a word of commentary, to the famous farmers, the sailors, and the mechanics, for when declaration of the gentleman from Boston, that grand objects are to be attained, how real and “ we should be careful how we strike the hand how solid such men appear in the presence of that feeds us." This, Sir, was the whole length mere scholars and talkers.” and breadth of my offending; and for this I have A distinguished gentleman once said to me been assailed with a contempt of manner and ap an individual of great attainments, and an acpearance of malignity, almost without parallel quaintance of the gentleman from Boston—"How in the history of legislative bodies.

astonishing it is that some men talk so well when The gentleman complains most bitterly that he they have so little practical sense;" and, said he, was misapprehended and misrepresented; but I “ how much knowledge some people have, with submit, Sir, whether the language of the gentle- very little wisdom !" Far be it from me to disman is not justly susceptible of such a construc parage literary attainments; no man values mention. When I heard the gentleman make the tal culture more than I do. Heaven knows how remark, I said to a friend near me, that I was gladly I would part with pecuniary possessions sorry to hear him make it, and that I did not be for a little, even, of that culture which is the lieve that he meant it. I also added, that he would pride and boast of the gentleman from Boston. never hear the last of it; and, Sir, I think my But, Sir, if I could have it all, if its possession prediction is likely to be fulfilled. I have heard involved the sacrifice of judgment and common many of that gentleman's political friends say that sense, I should say it was not worth having. Sir, they so understood it; and that, farthermore, I prize but little mere talking men. As an emithey believed that he had thus unwittingly re nent poet says-one whom the gentleman himself vealed the real sentiments of his heart. Now, is so fond of quoting:Sir, if members of that gentleman's political party

“ How fluent nonsense trickles from his tongue." say that the language was clearly susceptible of such a construction, certainly he cannot expect I have said thus much, Mr. President, because his political opponents to be any more charitable. I believed that the occasion demanded it; and if But permit me to say, that I am unwilling to be the gentleman from Boston is satisfied to have his lieve that the gentleman intended to make an ex unprovoked attack upon me go down to posterity hibition of such base servility as those remarks without a single word of explanation or apology, would seem to indicate. I advise him, however, upon the enduring records of this Convention, so for the future, instead of abusing others, for which let it be- I am content. his own imprudence is justly responsible, to try Mr. HILLARD, of Boston. The gentleman and learn wisdom from experience.

from Lynn has come here with an elaborate That gentleman spoke of me in terms of con speech, studiously prepared, stuffed with quotemptuous disparagement. Sir, I lay no claim to tations, and committed to memory, the whole the graces of oratory, but I was sent here by as purport of which is a glorification of himself and good a constituency as those whom that gentleman disparagement of me,-a glorification of men of represents. I came here for the purpose of en judgment, men of common sense, and men of deavoring to discharge my duty-not as brilliantly, ctical skill, and disparagement of men enbut as faithfully, and perhaps, as usefully as some dowed with those scholarly qualities which he of those who belong to the class whom that gen supposes I am endowed with. That part of his tleman represents; and I certainly did not expect remarks, Mr. President, I shall not reply to. I

Thursday,]

HILLARD – FRENCH.

(July 14th.

doubt if there is any gentleman in this Convention | I hope that those who remember it against me or out of it who has a lower estimate of my pow will remember the provocation also. I am not ers or my attainments, than I have myself. On going to repeat that performance. It is not to that side, at least, the gentleman may be assured my taste, and I do not think that any provocation that I am not vulnerable.

which can pass under the President's hammer, I never, to my recollection, saw the gentleman will induce me to recall this determination. from Lynn, until I met him in this Convention, Sir, the time of the Convention is precious. I and certainly never in any way gave him any pro will not occupy one moment of it in anything vocation. The other day, when he was addressing like personal altercation or party contest. And, the Convention upon some matter connected with Sir, still more:—the shadow of death is resting the question of representation, I was listening to upon the assembly. The hand of God has been him with attention, for his manner was becoming stretched forth, and has taken from us one whose and gentlemanly. As he had spoken but seldom, hopes where as warm, and whose prospects were I listened to him with a sincere wish to learn

as bright, as those of any of us. Some of the what manner of man he was. To my great sur clergymen in the Convention, the other day, took prise he wound off by saying, that after the threat occasion to enforce this dispensation upon our or the intimation which has fallen from the gen- minds, to speak to us of the vanity of human tleman from Boston, it became the Convention so

hopes and wishes, and to remind us that no one to arrange the system of representation as to pro

knew on whom the lot next might fall. I took tect the country against the city, or words to that their admonitions to heart, and, were there no effect, at the same time feathering his shaft by an other reason, I would not, while their teachings expressive glance at me.

are so fresh, obtrude upon the notice of the ConWas that an attack, or was it not ? Was my vention topics of discussion like those for which I reply provoked, or was it not? I submit that I asked their attention a few days ago. felt then, and I feel now, that the remark was

So much for our rights and duties as members made for the purpose of the fling at me, for no

of this Convention. As between man and man, man could make so fatuous a remark upon any if I have done the gentleman wrong, or wounded other explanation. The man who really thinks

his feelings, I regret it. And I hope he will bethat the country ought to be protected against the

lieve me, when I say that nothing that has passed city, has no right to be here. His place is in a

between us shall leave any permanent shadow of certain other Convention in the town of Somer unkindness or ill-will to rest upon my heart ; ville—a Convention that never adjourns, and and if an opportunity should occur hereafter, which is presided over by a member of this body.

in the chances and changes of life, in which I You, Mr. Chairman, (Mr. Wilson, of Natick,) with

can be of service to him, then, perhaps, I may be that courage and readiness which always charac

able to convince him of my sincerity in this terize you, came to the aid of our friend, and you last remark. said that I had not done right to bear so hard

Mr. OLIVER, of Lawrence. I move that the upon so respectable and so well-informed a gen

Convention do now adjourn. tleman. Sir, I thought of that scene in the

Mr. BIRD, of Walpole. On that motion I ask “ Merry Wives of Windsor" between Dr. Caius

for the yeas and nays. and Mrs. Quickly, when the doctor found the

(Cries of “No, no;" and “It will not save young man in his closet. Mrs. Quickly was sure

time.") that he was an honest man; whereupon the

The yeas and nays were not ordered, and the doctor replied by a pertinent question, “ What is

question recurring on the motion to adjourn, it the honest man doing in my closet ?" Now I

was decided in the negative. say, as Dr. Caius said : Why does this respectable and well-informed gentleman attack me with

Suspension of the Rules. out any provocation. So far as that attack was concerned, he was neither respectable nor well Mr. FRENCH, of New Bedford. I move that informed. I contend that my comment was no the rules of the Convention be suspended, in order more than the hard hitting which he had began, that the Convention may now proceed to the and of which he has no right to complain. second reading and final passage of the resolves

Mr. President, the gentleman in this personal in relation to the judiciary. We have now as explanation has adverted to many matters which full a house as we shall perhaps ever have; the I will not go into. A few days ago I took occa- subject has been most amply discussed, and I sion to make a personal explanation and vindica think by taking the final question to-night, we tion, which sometimes took the form of attack. shall save time and finally settle a question which

Thursday,]

BUTLER — GRISWOLD - HALLETT.

[July 14th.

has been much agitated. I hope the rules will motion was, just that we might get at the matter be suspended.

in the mode in which the chairman of that Com(Loud cries of “ No, no, no.")

mittee has suggested. This resolve is now in Mr. BUTLER, of Lowell. I desire to say that Committee of the Whole, and the only way that these resolves have been discussed and voted up we can get at it, is first to go into Committee of the on at a time when it would hardly be proper to Whole on the subject, and then report it to the take a final vote. Since the vote ordering them Convention with a recommendation that it be to a second reading was taken, a large number of referred to the Committee on the House of Repmembers have left the hall; and I think it would resentatives, and then it will come back to us be better for us to pause for a moment before we from that Committee. It was for the purpose of do this.

getting rid of one more subject from our calenMr. FRENCH. At the suggestion of friends, dar, that I made this motion to go into CommitI withdraw the motion.

tee of the Whole, so that this resolution might go

to its proper Committee and be disposed of in Quorum of the House of Representatives.

the shortest possible manner. I hope that it will On motion of Mr. BUTLER, of Lowell, the not generate any discussion, and that the ComConvention resolved itself into

mittee will now report it back to the Convention,

with a recommendation that it be referred to the COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE,

Committee on the House of Representatives. For the purpose of taking up a resolution of Mr. HALLETT, for Wilbraham. I would sugfered by Mr. COLE, of Cheshire, in relation to gest to the gentleman from Lowell, whether we the number of members necessary to constitute cannot get an expression of opinion upon this a quorum of the House of Representatives, Mr. subject now, and thus avoid the necessity of this Giles, of Boston, in the chair.

reference, and perhaps of considerable discussion The resolution was read, as follows:

afterwards. I am wearied with seeing these sub

jects referred and re-referred, and brought back Resolved, That the Constitution be so amended again here. Here is a simple proposition in rethat a majority of the members of the House of gard to a single delegate as to the number of memRepresentatives shall be necessary to constitute a

bers necessary to constitute a quorum of the quorum.

House of Representatives. I do not believe that Mr. GRISWOLD, for Erving. I would sug there is any material difference of opinion in regest to the gentleman from Lowell, not to go into gard to this subject. Nobody supposes that we Committee on this subject at this time. The shall have less than three nor more than four proposition before the Committee of the Whole is hundred representatives. Can there be any diffian order or resolve offered by the gentleman from culty, then, in fixing a number-say a hundred Cheshire, for the purpose, mainly, I apprehend, of and fifty, or two hundred? I would submit calling the attention of the Committee on the whether this resolve could not be amended so as House of Representatives to the subject. The to fix the number here, now, and then let the Committee on that subject have waited until this resolve, as amended, be reported to the Conventime to see what disposition the Convention would tion? Or, if it is to be referred, let it be referred make of the representation question, in order that with instructions, so that the Committee may rethey might know how large a House we would port it back, and it may be passed here without be likely to have. I purpose to call the Com discussion. Unless we adopt some such course mittee together to-morrow, for the purpose of act as this, we shall lose all the time we have spent ing upon this and several other subjects which upon it. If we expect to get through with this yet remain for their consideration, and I would Convention by August, we must dispose of these inquire of the gentleman from Lowell, whether things as they come up. I move, therefore, to he does not think that we will dispose of this amend the motion of the gentleman from Lowell, matter better by leaving it for that Committee to so as to resolve that it is inexpedient to adopt this report upon, taking this order also into considera- recommendation, and that we so report to the tion, and then for us to act upon the Report of Convention. I move that the Committee report that Committee: I merely make this suggestion. to the Convention that it is inexpedient that this I am willing that the question should be taken up resolution should pass. now, but I think it would save time to wait until Mr. GRISWOLD, for Erving. I have no we have the Report of the Committee which has objection to this matter being discussed and settled this matter specially under its consideration, here, instead of being referred back to the Com

Mr. BUTLER. The reason why I made this mittee on the House of Representatives ; but

Thursday,]

HALLETT – BUTLER - SCHOULER.

(July 14th.

there are serious differences of opinion in re should go on and discuss it here to-night, the lation to this matter. I incline myself to the Committee would come to their conclusion upon opinion, that the number necessary for the trans- | it, and report the same to the Convention, and action of business, should be higher than the then we should have the whole subject up, and present number of sixty. I think it should be a it would all be gone over again. It was, therehundred; but I shall go with the majority in fore, in order to save time all around, that I made regard to whatever number may be determined the motion, and if it had not been for the amendupon. I hope, therefore, that the amendment of ment of the gentleman for Wilbraham, (Mr. Halthe gentleman for Wilbraham, will not prevail, lett,) we should have been through with it, and because I suppose it precludes any action upon have proceeded to something else. What use is the subject by the other Committee. If the Com- there in trying to settle the matter here, while the mittee of the Whole are disposed to act finally whole subject is before the Committee on the upon the subject now, I would move to amend House of Representatives? The majority of that the amendment by substituting the number one Committee are not here, and when they come hundred” for the “majority;" but I do think that together, they may come to the conclusion to it would simplify the matter at this time to adopt report a very different resolve, and then we must the motion of the gentleman from Lowell, by review the whole matter. Why not have the having this Committee rise and report a reference whole subject before us at once ? of this resolution to the Committee on the House The gentleman thinks one hundred members a of Representatives. If, however, the gentleman good number to constitute a quorum. Well, for Wilbraham insists upon his amendment, I perhaps I think one hundred and twenty-five, have no objection, provided that the number be another thinks a hundred and fifteen ; four or fixed at one hundred.

five think a hundred and fifty is a good number. Mr. HALLETT. I have not the least objection And so we have a variety of opinions, and the to recommend to the Convention now, the amend-whole matter must be discussed. The gentleman ment of the gentleman, to my motion, that here- himself says there is a difference of opinion about it. after a quorum of the House should consist of When we come to go into the discussion of this one hundred members. That, perhaps, would meet matter, I shall be ready to say that I do not think the wishes all round. It is now required, by the the Constitution should give permission to threeConstitution, to be sixty. I see no practical quarters of the House of Representatives to go inconvenience in having it increased to one hun- home and leave the other quarter here to do busidred.

ness. I have seen fifty thousand dollars of the Mr. BUTLER, of Lowell. I have a word to State's money voted away when there were only say upon this matter, which I endeavored or forty-four members voting upon one side and intended to have said when I arose before.

forty odd upon the other, and I do not think it The CHAIRMAN. The Chair would state was a good sight. However, I am not going into that the third amendment is not strictly in order the general question. I think we had better let at this time. If the gentleman for Wilbraham, the whole matter go to the Committee on the will withdraw his amendment to the motion of House of Representatives, and we shall thereby the gentleman from Lowell, (Mr. Butler,) then save the time of the Convention. the amendment of the gentleman for Erving, Mr. SCHOULER, of Boston. I suppose that (Mr. Griswold,) will be in order.

under the general resolution, which refers all Mr. HALLETT. I accept the amendment of matters having reference to the House of Reprethe gentleman for Irving, as a substitute for mine. sentatives to the Committee upon that subject,

Mr. BUTLER. I was about to say that this matter of a quorum would be naturally the reason for my motion was this. This brought before us. As that subject is before the whole subject was referred to the Commit- Committee, of which I am a member, I trust that tee on the House of Representatives. The this matter will be referred to it, so that we may gentleman from Cheshire, (Mr. Cole,) brought act upon it and make one report upon the whole in a resolution on this subject—which he had

I think that is the quickest way to disa perfect right to do—and by inadvertence pose of it. that resolution was referred directly to the Com I think, upon reflection, that it will be found mittee of the Whole, instead of to the Committee that sixty members is a sufficient number to form having in charge matters of that nature. I knew a quorum, because the only difficulty about a that the Committee on the House of Repre- quorum has been when the House meets in the sentatives was to have a meeting to-morrow morning, and, for the last few years, the Speaker morning to discuss this very question, and if we has not called the House to order until some

matter.

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