I also beg leave to refer you to the cost of the repairs for frigates United States and Constellation, in this port, and the repairs of the frigate Constitution in Boston, in or about the year 1800 Should government direct the building of the double deck ships, I would by all means recommend the extension of their dimensions (the timber provided will admit of it) for by increasing their dimensions you increase their sailing. By building ships of war larger, and more powerful than those in Europe, you take a lead in two classes of ships (I mean double decked ships and large frigates) which will in a degree render the ships of Europe, of the same class, in a very great degree useless. But if you build of the same size and construction, you will always be behind; it is only by taking a bold lead you have any chance of succeeding. No necessary expense ought to be spared on this subject, for it is one of the most important in the formation of our navy. The recent and last most brilliant affair of the frigate Constitution, confirms this opinion. The excellent qualities of our large frigates has confirmed the arguments I made use of in favour of their size. In drafting the 74's I had not the same latitude; they are much smaller than I think they ought to be.

2. What is the price generally paid per ton for merchant ships? At what price could ships of war be built for per ton? Would ship-builders contract with government at settled prices?

The price generally paid for merchant ships is from twenty to thirty dollars per ton, according to their different forms; and if all of live-oak, perhaps forty dollars. There is no established rule in the United States for tonnaging ships between the builder and merchant; that of this port differs from Newyork, and I believe all the states to the castward vary materially in measurement. Those to the eastward of this port contain from 10 to 25 per cent. more nominal tons than a vessel built of the same size here. The tonnage vary more or less according to the dimensions, some dimensions making a greater increase than others.

I suppose double decked ships of war could be built for from forty-five to fifty dollars per ton for labour, having all the timber in the yard, and would cost completely fitted about 225 dollars per ton; and large frigates from forty to forty-five dollars per ton, and completely equipped about 210 dollars per ton, supposing them to be framed, and all the frames of live-oak.

I should suppose no prudent builder would contract to build large frigates, or double deck ships at any price; neither do I believe it would be the interest of the United States to contract for them. Small ships of war, of five or six hundred tons, I have no doubt but they could be had by contract.

3, 4. What time would be required to build a 74 in the port of Philadelphia, admitting the necessary timber was already in the yard? What time is generally consumed for building a merchant ship of three hundred tons? Do they last in proportion to the time employed in building?

A 74 may be built in about twelve months, if all the materials are provided; merchant ships generally take from four to six months. I do not know that it makes any difference as to the time employed in building.

5. What is the average duration of the ships built in Phila delphia, under proper precautions, and of the most approved materials?

It is almost impossible to state an average time the ships built in this port will last; their duration will be more or less according to the climate they go first into. Vessels making their first voyages to Europe, with a return cargo of salt, as already stated, will last several years longer than those sent into a warm climate without that cargo. Cargoes of grain, pepper, or any articles that will heat, are very pernicious to vessels, and very much facilitate their decay. There are now several vessels belonging to this port, and built here, twenty-one years old, and are commonly called live-oak and cedar ships; the floors and raising timbers, and lower futtocks, are of white-oak, and in a very decayed state. Hd these timbers been put in of live-oak, these ships would last until they were thirty years old.

I am of opinion most of those ships ought to be condemned, unless they were to have a very heavy repair, more than I should consider them worth. I am of opinion the average time may be stated from fifteen to twenty years, but this almost altogether depends on their first voyage and their cargoes.

6. Have you any knowledge of the premature decay of the ships of war belonging to the United State? If yea, to what cause do you attribute it, and what are the tions you would recommend in future?

precau

The first knowledge I had of the decay of our ships of war, was in the year 1800, on board the frigate United States, about three years after she was lanched. Having been in the habit of salting all the merchant ships I built, I strongly pressed the necessity of salting the frigate United States; but it was opposed by captain Barry. He stated it would make the ship damp and unhealthy, and he carried his point. The want of this necessary precaution was one reason why the cause of decay affected that ship so much. I am convinced the decay was caused by the foul air of the ship, and for want of a free circulation of fresh air, and I am confirmed in this opinion from the following facts: I found, in taking off the plank, that above almost every port till where the foul air was in a great degree excluded, the plank was much less affected, and in some places not at all. The spare gun carriages were laid in the hold, one on the other, and the foul air lodging between them, where I suppose there was little or no circulation, that part of both brackets that laid on each other was decayed, when the other parts were sound, owing to the air not being so confined.

In the frigate Constellation, where the bulk-heads were nailed to the beams, and where I conceived the foul air lodged, as the common movements in the vessel could give it little or no circulation, I found the beams rotten, not in the heart (that part being sound, as is generally the case in all our large white-oak, they decay first in the heart) but the outside. This was the first instance of the kind I had ever met with. From these facts I am firmly persuaded the premature decay in our ships was caused by the foul air in the hold, and which 1 as firmly believe may be

prevented by salt and a sufficient ventilation. To remedy the evil in some degree in the United States, I had hung between every gun port a hanging port, with a communication from all the timbers between the gun ports, by a rabbit in the edges of the plank, in which there were fixed a thin plank, that was one and a half inches clear of the timbers; through this opening I conceived the air would circulate. These ports kept constantly opening and shutting; as the ship healed the weatherside opening, the seaside shutting. If ships were to be salted there would be no occasion for this precaution, neither would it have any good effect, as all the rooms between the timber would be filled with salt. Whether the same precaution was made use of on board the Constellation while under repair, I cannot say, nor what was the result of those on board the United States, as I was discharged from the service before the Constellation was finished. 7. Would you under any circumstances advise ships of war

to undergo a thorough repair, or do you deem it preferable to put them out of service, when in a condition to need such repairs?

Under some circumstances I would advise very considerable repairs-Where a ship has been found to be of superior construction, where her qualities exceed any other ship, in such cases I would advise a repair, if it would amount to the cost of a new vessel.

In the merchant service, I have always advised my employers, when their ships wanted considerable repairs, to dispose of them. But with government it is different; their old ships cannot be disposed of; they are seldom suitable for merchants; they are therefore under the necessity of giving their vessels sometimes heavy repairs. It is a very difficult point to ascertain the true state of a ship, even by the most experienced and disinterested persons. Officers sometimes press considerable repairs of their vessels, even should the cost exceed her value when she is repaired, for fear of losing their command; and there are very few who have had sufficient experience to form correct opinions; and so various are the opinions of commanders, that let the most experienced one of the navy have the fitting of a ship, and then

change the commander, and if he has time and liberty will run the public to very considerable expense in alterations he will state to be absolutely necessary. True principles ought to be fixed on by which all vessels belonging to the United States should be fitted, and no alteration should be allowed, but what could be done with the crew of the ship, without any additional

cost.

There are certain considerations to be taken into view, before an opinion could be formed, whether great and extensive repairs ought to be gone into, particularly the relative cost and firmness when completed and compared with that of a new one, that unless the advantage was very obvious and clear, repairs ought not to be gone into. It is a fact, that after the strictest examination and calculations made when you have taken out the defective parts first discovered, you will always find more, so that you never know the cost until the repairs are completed.

8. Are there any natural obstructioas in the bay or river Delaware to prevent the free ingress and egress of ships of war?

I conceive there are no obstructions in the Delaware river or bay up as high as the bar, a little below fort Mifflin, to prevent any ship of war that the United States have, or that it will be necessary for them to have, but what may be avoided by good pilots (see the pilots' certificate enclosed) and by lightening them, may be taken up to the navy-yard with less difficulty than they can be taken to the navy-yard at Washington. Should we have double deck ships, they will draw very little, if any more water than our large frigates.

We, the undersigned pilots, do certify, that any ship, not exceeding twenty-three feet water, may be piloted up the Delaware as far as the bar near fort Mifin.

September 1st, 1812.
(Signed)

STEPHEN FLANAGAN.

JOHN HARE

SIMEON PALMER.

THOMAS SAUNDERS.

VINCENT LOWE.