Industrial Recovery Act was passed, what his opinion is as to the situation that will develop if this legislation, or legislation seeking these objectives, is not passed at this session of Congress? Senator WAGNER. In my opinion, failure to pass this legislation will certainly jeopardize the whole recovery program, because we have a situation now where employers under the Recovery Act have been encouraged not only afforded the opportunity, but encouraged to organize trade organizations. They are better organized today, may I say to the Senator, than they have ever been. On the other hand, the workers, to whom we supposed we had given equal rights of organization, have had their efforts resisted at every turn, particularly by the large manufacturers, who have refused to recognize the men's representatives and have put every obstacle in the way of organization. Now, such an uneven industrial situation cannot continue without a collapse. Senator LA FOLLETTE. There has been an increased indication of labor difficulties and strikes. What in your opinion is the chief cause of that manifestation? Senator WAGNER. The very thing I said, failure to recognize the representatives that the workers had chosen. That has been the controversy in 70 percent of the cases before the Labor Board-an extraordinary thing. I might say also that there is a concerted anti-union effort among at least some employers, for since the Recovery Act there has been an extraordinary growth of company-dominated organizations. Senator LA FOLLETTE. If legislation of this character is not passed at this session, what is your view as to the probability of increasing or decreasing labor difficulties and strikes during the balance of this year? Senator WAGNER. I am afraid we shall have tremendous difficulties. I was going to say, almost so much that we shall not be able to cope with them. I do not want to make any such pessimistic prediction, but I sat all day yesterday at a Labor Board hearing which involved the question of recognition, and all that the workers asked in that case, and in a similar case today-perhaps we have today the most important case in the history of the Board-was an opportunity to elect their representatives. There is resistance to that request, and this has threatened to throw 100,000 on strike if the difficulties are not composed. Senator LA FOLLETTE. Is it a fair deduction, from your answer, Senator, that you view with grave alarm the situation so far as strikes and labor difficulties are concerned in the near future unless legislation of this kind is passed? Senator WAGNER. I am terribly concerned. The CHAIRMAN. Senator, there is no provision in this bill that denies the right to organize company unions? Senator WAGNER. Oh, no. The CHAIRMAN. The majority of the employees in any industry can organize a company union if they choose to? Senator WAGNER. Of course, what we are preventing is only domination by employers. The CHAIRMAN. From your experience, I judge there has been a tendency on the part of employers, particularly large employers, to try to create company unions with the idea that they could dominate them more easily than they could independent labor organizations? Senator WAGNER. Exactly, and when I speak of the company union, the objectionable company union, I mean the one dominated or influenced by the employer. The CHAIRMAN. How are you going to prevent an aggressive, dominating employer from getting control of 51 percent of his employees in order to control his company union? Senator WAGNER. The only way is to prohibit, as we attempt to do in this legislation, the specific acts which experience has shown are the acts by which they influence the action of an organization. Senator LA FOLLETTE. Right on that point, Senator, what has been the experience of the Board in plants where employers have contended that there was no sentiment for an independent labor organization and where the Board has been able to provide for a vote on the part of the workers where they felt that their identity was not to be disclosed and they would be protected from any reprisal? Senator WAGNER. I can give the Senator an instance that happened only last week in a very large factory in a Southern State where there were over 3,000 employees. A substantial number of them requested our board to order an election. They had a so-called "representation plan" under which they became very restive because they felt it was simply an employer-dominated organization. After some efforts we finally persuaded the employer to consent to such an election. We were told at the time that it was a useless procedure, that the workers all wanted this representative plan, and that we were inconveniencing the employers for no good purpose. An election was held and the company union was defeated by the outside union by a vote of 20 to 1. This is what happened when employees had a free choice, and were able to cast their ballots without any interference, intimidation, or coercion. The CHAIRMAN. Is this bill the result of the experience of those who have been associated with you on the Labor Board trying to find a solution for the evils or barriers that were experienced in the handling of this problem? Senator WAGNER. I cannot speak for all members of the board, but it certainly reflects the experience of some of us. It reflects my own experience. As to this legislation, I alone am responsible for it, and I do not want to hold anyone else responsible. The CHAIRMAN. For the record, Senator, will you tell us just how the Labor Board is constituted and what are its functions? Senator WAGNER. Well, it is a body of citizens appointed by the President, really not holding any public office at all. We take no oath nor do we receive compensation The CHAIRMAN. How many members? Senator WAGNER. Eleven. The CHAIRMAN. And what do they represent in the private affairs of life? Senator WAGNER. Five are representatives of the workers and five represent industry. If you will exclude myself, I think they are very eminent members, all very well known in their respective fields. The CHAIRMAN. And are you the 11th member? Senator WAGNER. I am the impartial chairman. The CHAIRMAN. Just what problems are delegated to you? Senator WAGNER. Simply to compose labor disputes, for which purpose we have outlined our own procedure. 46652-34-PT 1-2 The CHAIRMAN. How do they arise? Does someone petition you where there is a labor difficulty, either the employer or the employees? Senator WAGNER. Yes. One side or the other asks us to intervene, and sometimes we even intrude where we think think a strike is imminent which we may prevent. The Board has not done its work dramatically or spectacularly, but I think has made an extraordinary contribution toward preserving industrial peace. The CHAIRMAN. It is all voluntary, I assume? The CHAIRMAN. And have you worked out your own regulations and methods of procedure? Senator WAGNER. Yes, we have. We have 20 regional boards through the country, upon which serve the most eminent citizens available in the various communities. They work without compensation and have rendered an effective and patriotic service. The CHAIRMAN. Are there any statistics available as to the number of strikes that have taken place since the N.R.A. began to operate? Senator WAGNER. We have available statistics of those of which we are cognizant. We have made reports on that. The CHAIRMAN. Could we have it? Senator WAGNER. I shall be delighted to bring them. The CHAIRMAN. I understood you to say that 75 percent of these strikes that have come to your attention have been due directly or indirectly to the failure of the employer to recognize the rights of the employee to organize as of their own choosing? Senator WAGNER. Exactly; the disputes were not always strikes, for we have prevented The CHAIRMAN. Threatened strikes? Senator WAGNER. Yes, exactly, where there have been disputes involved. Senator LA FOLLETTE. I want to suggest, Mr. Chairman, that it might be well to have those statistics that you refer to incorporated at the conclusion of Senator Wagner's testimony so that they will be in the record. Senator WAGNER. I will present them. (The statistics referred to by Senator La Follette, presented by Senator Wagner, follow:) TABLE I.-Regional labor boards' summary SUMMARY OF TABLES OF NATIONAL AND REGIONAL LABOR BOARDS Total cases: National, 190; regional, 1,628; total, 1,818. Cases settled: National, 132; regional, 1,121; total, 1,253. Of these, cases settled by agreements were: National, 103; regional, 533; total, 636. Settled by decisions: National, 29; regional, 254; total, 283. Total workers involved: National, 400,000; regional, 514,000; total, 914,000. Strikes: National, 132, involving 325,000; regional, 467, involving 170,000; total, 599, involving 495,000. Strikes settled: National, 107, involving 213,000; regional, 371, involving 131,000; total, 478, involving 344,000 (strikers returned to work). Strikes averted: National, 24, involving 33,500; regional, 173, involving 105,500; total, 197, involving 139,000 (kept at work). Workers reinstated (exclusive of strike figures) after charges of discrimination, unjust layoffs, etc.: Regional, 6,852. Cases pending: National, 27; regional, 295 (incomplete); total, 322. In addition, National referred 25 to regional boards). Causes of complaint Alleged violation of section 7(a) (collective bargaining, union discharge for union activity, interference, etc.): National, 145; regional, 777 (incomplete); total, 922. Wage demands: National, 37; regional, 241; (incomplete) total, 278. Reduced weekly earnings (generally under shortened code hours): Regional, 43. Elections supervised: National, 39; regional, 58; total, 97. Cases jointly submitted for arbitration: National, 11; regional, 59; total, 70. The CHAIRMAN. I think we also ought to have in the record the language of section 7 (a) to which you refer, and which I notice was not set forth in your speech. Senator WAGNER. All right. The CHAIRMAN. I think it is rather necessary to have that in view of your basing your reasons for this legislation upon the misinterpretation of the section and failure of it to function clearly in the interests of the employees. (Section 7 (a) of the National Industrial Recovery Act is as follows:) 7 (a) Every code of fair competition, agreement, and license approved, prescribed, or issued under this title shall contain the following conditions: (1) That employees shall have the right to organize and bargain collectively through representatives of their own choosing and shall be free from the interference, restraint, or coercion of the employers of labor, or their agents, and the designation of such representatives or in self-organization or any other concerted activities for the purpose of collective bargaining or their mutual aid or protection; (2) That no employee, and no one seeking employment, shall be required as a condition of employment to join any company union or to refrain from joining, organizing, or assisting a labor organization of his own choosing; and (3) That employers shall comply with the maximum hours of labor, minimum rates of pay, and other conditions of employment, approved or prescribed by the President. Senator WAGNER. My own view has always been, Mr. Chairman, that the present company-dominated union is a violation of section 7 (a) as it exists today. But I do not know what the courts would do, and there have been others administering the law who differ with my interpretation. This bill is simply to carry out what I believe is in the intent of Congress. Senator LA FOLLETTE. One other question, Senator: Is it your view or is it not that this legislation is permanent in character, and that the services to be rendered by the Board which the bill would establish would be rendered regardless of congressional or executive determination or as to the continuance of the National Industrial Recovery Administration? Senator WAGNER. Oh, yes; this is permanent legislation. create a permanent body and, I think, a very essential one. it is a great step forward. It is to |