FEB. 1, 1825.]

Creek Indian Negotiation-General Appropriation Bill.

[H. of R.

The resolution was then agreed to without opposition.

GENERAL APPROPRIATION BILL.

The House then passed to the unfinished business of yesterday, which was the bill making appropriations for the support of Government for the year 1825.

On that section of the bill which makes appropriation for the public buildings in Washington City, Mr.COCKE, of Tenn., moved an amendment, which went to provide that no part of the sum appropriated, should be applied to pay the sum offered by the Commissioner of the Public Buildings for a design to ornament the tympanum of the Portico of the Capitol.

Pole Cat Spring, in October, and the determination | ance of the obligations of the United States, under the made at Tuckabotchee was confirmed, and ordered to act of cession of 1802, with that plan. He should consibe made public. The two documents were published der a determination to that effect as an indefinite postas a sort of manifesto to the world that no more Creek ponement of justice to Georgia. He hoped the Comlands would be sold to the United States. These docu-mittee on Indian Affairs would consider them separatements were signed by the Little Prince, his mark, byly, and bring the two subjects separately and distinctly the King Big Warrior, his mark; the Head Wolf, his before the House, whatever might be their opinions mark, &c.; none of the persons signing the first being upon them. able to read or write, and but one or two who signed the second. The Commissioners of the United States, on their way to the Broken Arrow, heard, for the first time, of these strange papers, the Indian agent not having considered it his duty either to prevent the determination they announced, or to communicate them to the War Department; the sub-agent, who ate the bread of the United States, was active in promoting these determinations, and was supposed to be the Secretary of one, if not both the meetings. The Commissioners found the Creeks, to the number of ten or fifteen thousand, assembled at the Broken Arrow, ready to assist in consuming the fifty thousand dollars appropriated by Congress for the expenses of the treaty. Their Chiefs, living in Alabama, determined not to make a treaty; the sub-agent, actively employed to defeat the wishes of the Government, and the principal agent acting a part of dignified neutrality, because he had not been instructed by the Secretary of the Department of War to promote the views of Congress, no treaty could be formed, as might have been expected. Notwithstanding the manifesto of the Chiefs, the hostility of the sub-agent, and the dignified neutrality of the principal, the Commissioners found twenty-four Chiefs, representing all the Indians residing in Georgia, willing to remove to the West, and give up all the land occupied by them -all the Creek Indian claim in the limits of that state. These Chiefs represented about ten thousand Indians,and their price, including all the expenses for their removal, was $300,000. Unfortunately, the Commissioners did not conceive themselves authorized to make a contract with them. One of the Commisioners came to this place to ask that authority from the Executive. It was not given. New instructions had been given, and a new meeting was to be held, from which the President seemed to expect a more favorable result. Mr. F. ap. prehended that the present effort would not be more fortunate than the last.

On this amendment some conversation arose between the chairman of the Committee of Ways and Means and the member from Tennessee. It was stated, on one hand, that the offer made by the Commissioner was done in consequence of the advice and direction of the Ex. ecutive; that it was in coincidence with the course pursued on other similar cases; that the ornament for the Capitol was fit and necessary; and the reward calculated to call forth taste and genius in preparing it, &c. On the other hand, it was contended that the providing of this design was a part of the duty of the architect, who receives a salary for his services-that the offer was unauthorized on the part of the Commissioner, and unnecessary. The amendment, however, was at length withdrawn by the mover.

The following, among other items, were added by way of amendment to this bill:

"For repairs to the General Post Office and yard, $2,000."

66

For paving the footway in front of the public ground on the South side of the Pennsylvania Avenue, between the Capitol and the Navy Office, and for placing stone steps at the several entrances of the Navy Office, $6,161 97."

A second section was added to the bill, on motion of Mr. McLANE, in the usual form, prohibiting payment of moneys, appropriated by this act, to persons indebted to the United States, until their arrears shall be paid.

And a third section was added, on motion of Mr. VINTON, of Ohio, in the words following:

Mr. F. said he felt great reluctance to state what he had been informed the Executive had directed to be done in this stage of things. He hoped that the documents might shew that he was misinformed. For their insolent interference to obstruct the execution of one of the laws of the United States, the wishes of Congress, "Scc. 3. That the Secretary of the Treasury be, and and the instructions of the Executive, the Cherokee he is hereby, authorized and required to pay, out of any Chiefs were to be reproved by the Secretary of War. money in the Treasury, not otherwise appropriated, the The principal Creek agent, who was a dignified neutralsum or sums of money to which any person, or the legal between his own Government and the Creeks; who representative of any person, may be entitled, by virtue thought a law of Congress, and the instructions of the Executive to the Commissioners, not sufficient to make it his duty to act with the Commissioners; he was to be reprimanded by the Secretary of War. The only decisive step, was the removal of the sub-agent. The successor of the sub-agent, no noubt warned by the fate of his predecessor, would take care to ape the conduct of the principal, and be ostensibly neutral, secretly hos tile. Such were the circumstances under which Mr. F. had felt it his duty to bring the subject before the House, by his resolution, adopted yesterday, and that now under consideration.

The President, in his late message to Congress, had connected the performance of the obligations of the United States to Georgia, with the great plan of collecting all the Indians in our Western territory, for the purpose of civilizing them. Of this plan, it was not now proper to speak. It might be wise, humane, and politic, but Mr. F. protested against connecting the perform

of an act authorizing repayment for land erroneously sold by the United States, upon such person, or his or her legal representative, complying with the requisitions of that act."

Among other amendments proposed,

Mr. COCKE moved to double the appropriation for compensating the messengers who bring to the seat of Government the votes for President and Vice President: and a desultory debate rose on the motion, in which Messrs. McLANE, COCKE, TAYLOR, COOK, WEBSTER, and TUCKER, took part. The amendment was finally withdrawn, there being already a bill passed by the Senate, now before a committee of the House, on the same subject, and it being considered more proper to act upon the subject directly by that bill.

Mr. TATTNALL, of Georgia, moved to add the bill a clause, making provision for the payment of Georgia militia claims, of the period of 1793–94, in which he was supported by Mr. FORSYTH. A question of

H. of R. & Sen.]

General Appropriation Bill.-Suppression of Piracy.

[FEB. 1, 2, 1825.

order arose, which gave occasion to considerable dis- cominitted for the purpose of receiving such shape as cussion on the part of Messrs. TATTNALL, TAYLOR, would be generally agreeable to the Senate; but he FORSYTH, HAMILTON, CAMPBELL, CLAY, and would waive his motion until the sense of the Senate WEBSTER. It was finally decided, that, inasmuch as had been expressed on those amendments; and he acthe report of the Committee on Military Affairs, in res-cordingly, for the present, withdrew it. pect to those claims, had been taken from a committee of the whole, and recommitted to the committee, with instructions, it was not in order to introduce a proposi tion into this bill on that subject.

The committee then rose, and reported the bill, as amended, and it was ordered to be engrossed for a third reading.

The House then went into committee of the whole, Mr. LATHROP in the chair, on the bill "making appropriations for the Military Service of the United States, for the year 1825;" which was amended, by the addition of a clause appropriating, for the expense of surveys, &c. made under the act to provide for internal improvements, $28,567, and then ordered to a third reading. The same committee then took up the bill "making appropriations for the support of the Navy of the United States, for the year 1825."

Mr. COCKE moved to reduce the amount of the appropriation for contingent expenses of the navy, from $200,000 to $195,000.

The motion was resisted by Mr. McLANE, who declared himself ready to prove, by documentary evidence, that the whole amount had been devoted to the objects designated by law, and to those only, and that, instead of being too great, it was, in fact, too small, to meet the necessities of the service.

The motion of Mr. COCKE was negatived. The contingent fund (for officers' transportation, &c.) which had, but last year, been reduced from 14,000 to 9,000 dollars, was again raised to its former amount, and the 5,000 in arrears for the last year, was provided for by a distinct item of appropriation.

The committee then rose, and reported the bill, which, as amended, was ordered to be engrossed for a third reading.

IN SENATE.-WEDNESDAY, FEBRUARY 2, 1825.
SUPPRESSION OF PIRACY.

The Senate again took up the bill "for the Suppression of Piracy." The following motion, made yesterday, by Mr. VAN BUREN, being still pending, viz:

The question then recurred on the following section, which Mr. HOLMES, of Maine, yesterday offered, viz: "Sec. 3. And be it further enacted, That no public armed vessel of the United States, authorized and employed for the suppression of piracy, shall be engaged or employed in the transportation of specie, or any other article of freight, unless specially designated therefor by the President of the United States."

Mr. COBB, of Georgia, moved to strike out the words "unless specially designated therefor by the President of the United States."

Mr. COBB said he thought, from the documents which had been communicated by the Executive, it was sufficiently evident that this business of the transportation of specie in public armed vessels of the United States must be a source of great emolument to those en. gaged in it. The officers of our naval force being like other men, would be unwilling to relinquish so profitable a trade, and it was a strong impression on his mind, that, so long as the practice continued, piracy never would be suppressed. If piracy were suppressed, there would be no further occasion for their being employed, but, so long as it continued, this system of jobbing would be pursued. Every temptation ought to be removed that would induce them to lax in the discharge of their duties. Let them be employed in the suppression of piracy alone.

Mr. HOMES, of Maine, said, he understood it had been the practice for the President of the United States to designate the vessels which should be employed in this service of the transportation of specie-but there was nothing prohibitory, in the law and regulations against other vessels doing the same. The consequence had been, that some part of the squadron had been employed in the transportation of specie. He should be unwilling to prevent the Executive designating, if he should see fit, the vessels which should be employed in the transportasion of specie; but, at the same time, to say that other public armed vessels, not so designated, should not be so employed, would be to strike at the root of the evil. He thought piracy would have been suppressed by this time, had it not been for the cupidity of our naval officers.

Resolved, That the bill" For the Suppression of Piracy in the West Indies," be recommitted to the Committee on Foreign Relations, with instructions to report amendments thereto, giving power to the President, on its being satisfactorily proved to him that any of the pirates mentioned in the said act, find refuge in any of the cities or ports of the said Island of Cuba, or other Islands mentioned in the said bill, and that the local Governments of the said Islands, on being requested so to do, neglect or refuse to aid in the apprehension, prose-practice. They ought, in his opinion, to apply for incution, and conviction of such pirates, to give authority to the crews of the armed vessels of the United States, under such instructions as may be given them, to land on the said Islands, in search of pirates, and there to subdue, vanquish, and capture them, and bring them to the United States for trial and adjudication, as the said instructions of the President of the United States may prescribe: and further, to authorize reprisals on the commerce and property of the inhabitants of the said

Islands.

Mr. BARBOUR made a few remarks against the principle proposed in the instructions, and also against recommitting the bill to the Committee on Foreign Relations.

Mr. VAN BUREN replied to Mr. B. and had no disposition to burthen the committee with a duty which was not acceptable. As there were many propositions before the Senate for amending the bill, he wished it re

Mr. LLOYD, of Mass., said, that, in the documents on the table, there was but one allegation, and that by an individual, to prove that the public vessels had quitted their station, to transport specie, and had thus left the commerce unprotected. He doubted the existence of this fact to any great extent, and certainly the Senate ought not to legislate on it without having the fullest and most authentic information as to the extent of the formation to that Department which knew what had been done. There was a regulation by which every officer was obliged to report, on his return home, what he had received; therefore, if the Senate called for information, there was no doubt of its being furnished. Mr. L. said he would suppose that an insurrection should break out in a town where our vessels were stationedHavana for instance--what would be the consequence? Our merchants had large sums of money there, and had no vessels to carry it away; it would be lost, because the public vessels would be forbidden, by law, to carry it away. Mr. L. said he was willing to agree with the gentleman from Maine, as to prohibiting the transportation of specie, excepting with instructions from the President or head of the Navy Department, but he hoped that his amendment would not go farther.

Mr. COBB said that the gentleman from Massachusetts seemed to doubt the authenticity of the statement

FEB. 2, 1825.]

Suppression of Piracy.

which had been made; but his (Mr. C's) reasons for not doubting it was this: those documents had been presented to the Senate by the Navy Department, and if that Department had not believed in their authenticity they would never have communicated them. What has thus been laid before us, said Mr. C. is a convincing reason why piracy has not been suppressed, and it is the particular reason of my making the motion. The trade of transporting specie must afford great profit to the naval officers who are engaged in it. This temptation is such as to draw their attention from subjects of infinitely greater importance, and unless it is removed they never will perform their duty.

Mr. MILLS, of Massachusetts, thought that the amendment would operate to a greater extent than was anticipated. All public armed vessels were authorized to suppress pirates wherever they met with them. The amendment would go to prohibit the transportation of specie in public armed vessels altogether. Piracy did not exist in the West Indies alone. By act of Congress, the slave trade was piracy, and slave dealers were pirates; therefore, a vessel on the coast of Africa would be prohibited transporting specie as well as a vessel in the West India seas. The modification suggested by his colleague, (Mr. LLOYD,) would have been more proper than this; for that would have prohibited at once all armed vessels transporting specie.

The question was then taken on Mr. COBB'S amendment, and lost.

Mr. CHANDLER moved to amend the section so as to prohibit all public armed vessels whatever from transporting specie, except such as should be specially designated by the President of the United States for the purpose; and he said that he was well satisfied that this traffic prevented piracy from being suppressed. The gentlemen of the Navy would, no doubt, like to make a little profit when they could do it legally, and on some stations the practice was very lucrative. Sometimes one commanding officer would have the benefit, some times another. Some would make more, and some nothing at all, which produced a soreness amongst the gentlemen of the Navy, while it seemed to divert their attention from the real and important object in view; and as long as this practice continued, the service must suffer by it. It should, therefore, be prohibited, except where the President thought it necessary to point out certain vessels to perform that duty.

[Senate.

Mr LLOYD, of Md., said, that last session the Senate had passed a bill regulating the transportation of specie, and sent it to the other House, but it was not acted on. They had also passed a bill authorizing the building of ten sloops of war, but it had not been acted on. Were they to be told that these sloops of war were necessary for the suppression of piracy, or that they were intended exclusively for that object? No; they were necessary for our service, and he believed it was enough to authorize a law to build them, no matter whether they were connected with the piratical or any other question. He was very anxious to suppress this transportation of specie in public armed vessels. It was necessary, as far as regarded the moral and physical force of the Navy, that it should be prohibited, not only in the Gulf of Mexico, but in every part of the world. We were now beginning to feel the ill effects of this system; the squadron sent to the Gulf of Mexico, was useless, from this cause. In the South sea this traffic for such he must call itwas carried on to a greater extent than in any other part, and it would have the same effect in every part of the world-that of impairing the moral and physical force of the Navy. He did not perceive any thing incongruous in making this general provision in the bill for the suppression of piracy; it was as much connected with it as the bill for building ten sloops of war. He believed our naval officers to be the bravest and best on the face of the globe, but, if we placed temptations in their way, which it was not in the power of human nature to resist, we lessened their moral elevation, and lowered that chivalrous character which they ought always to preserve He did not suspect them of sacrificing their duty, but it was necessary to guard them from all those temptations which might induce them to do so. The moment a soldier or officer lost that high principle which ought to characterize a military man, and became a trader in gold and silver, that moment his moral force was destroyed. What danger could result to the interest of this country from regulating the_transportation of specie? They would not allow the President to point out where it should be carried. Did they doubt that he would ever refuse to transport the specie of the citizens of America? If they did doubt it, they must suppose he was unmindful of the interest of those citizens. It might be necessary, and in many instances be proper, to transport specie in armed vessels, but let this specie belong to the citizens of America, and not that belong. ing to foreign powers. If this provision were made, it would redound to the benefit of the commere of the country, and the good of the Navy; and as they could not get this provision in a direct bill, they would be satisfied to procure it otherwise.

Mr. HOLMES, of Maine, said he always thought it was necessary to confine legislation to the subject matter before them-they were now providing for the suppression of piracy, and he hoped they would confine themselves to that subject. If they wished to enact a general law for the regulation of the Navy, they ought Mr. LLOYD, of Massachusetts, said, the current was to do so. It was a misfortune, he said, that there was running very strong against the transportation of specie not a naval peace establishment adopted, and he thought | in public vessels; but he believed it to be a very useful it was time there was one; but it could not be provided thing. It was not at all a novel principle, but had been for in a bill intended for a different purpose. The want acted upon by Great Britain for ages. She expressly auof such a law had produced all the evils complained of, thorized her naval officers to do it. If abuses crept into and many more; and one principle which ought to be in this system, why were they not remedied? why put this such a law, was that which his colleague had suggested. sweeping restriction on it? He believed it was a thing They had not yet been able to pass a general bill, or to which might be easily regulated. If the President were do any thing more for the regulation of the Navy than required to designate the vessels which were to perform regarded the pay of the sailors; and the pay of the offi- this duty, how could he possibly do it? how could he cers was provided for only by restrictions in the appro- foresee what occurrences might take place, or what priation bill. He regretted these things was not more changes or emergencies happen in the West Indies or specially provided for, but it was not regular to attempt elsewhere? Mr. L. observed there had been a sweeping it in a bill of this sort. If the Legislature confined them- denunciation pronounced against the whole of the naval selves to the object before them, he thought they could officers employed in the West India service. Would the not miss it. With regard to his own amendment, he Senate sanction such a charge as this without properly thought it was a proper one. Some were of opinion he ascertaining the facts on which it was founded? He had gone too far, but others thought he had not gone looked upon it in a very serious light. If the gentleman far enough. He agreed with the gentleman from Mass. would so modify his resolution as to prohibit the transthat the President ought to have the power of designat-portation of specie, except with instructions from the ing the vessels which should be employed, but he could not make the amendment he suggested.

President, he would agree with him. As this charge
Irad been seriously made, this bill should lie on the tas

Senate.]

Suppression of Piracy.

[FEB. 2, 1825.

ble with the amendment, till they could ascertain | fleet was to make them carriers of gold and silver for the what were the instructions given by the Secretary of profit of the officers of the Navy. He did not think the the Navy to the officers, as regarded the transporta- amendment would operate, as his friend from Maryland tion of specie, and to what extent the practice had pre-seemed to think it would; if the amendment succeedvailed.

ed, the President might authorize all ships to be carriMr. SMITH said he was against the motion made by ers, and under such circumstances as he might direct. the gentleman from Maine, (Mr. CHANDLER.) The offi Mr. C. said his object was not to prevent the carrying of cers of the Navy had not, in his opinion, done any thing specie, under any circumstances whatever, but, if it were to draw censure on them; they had acted according to to be carried at all, the Navy ought not to profit by ittheir instructions. [Here Mr. SMITH quoted the instruc- if their pay was not sufficient, he would say, give them tions from the documents on the table.] These, said more, but do not let them depend on individual mer. Mr. S. being the instructions, no possible blame could chants of the United States for their compensation. be attached to the officers of the Navy, for conforming Mr. LLOYD, of Maryland, said, that he had engaged to them. Mr. S. then remarked that we carried on a unexpectedly in the debate. He had certainly been great and increasing trade through Alvarado and Tam- misunderstood if he had been supposed to have said, or pico; the returns were principally in specie, for there intended to have said, any thing disrespectful of the was nothing else to be got there, and it was very unsafe officers of the Navy generally. He believed they were to trust this on board of unarmed vessels. Government inferior to none in respectability; but they were like might direct one vessel, and one only, to transport the other classes of men, and there might be some amongst specie, but, without that protection, it would be very them who were not quite what they ought to be. They dangerous to carry on the trade. Our manufactures, said were not now erecting a tribunal to decide on the merits Mr. S. are preferred to all others in the South American of their naval officers-they were trying now to erect a market, and our merchants had established their agents system for the suppression of piracy, by which they in the interior, to whom they sent their manufactures for might remove all the obstacles which were stated to sale-the returns were generally in specie; and would them by the President, as existing unfavorable to that they endanger this trade, for fear that the naval officers view. They were told, amongst other things, by the should be drawn away from their employment? He could respectable agent, (Mr. Randall,) that the transportanot understand this. The amendinent, as it now stood, tion of specie through the Gulf of Mexico, has been one without any alteration to it, was a very good one. It of the means of preventing the suppression of piracy. might be, Mr. S. said, that the prejudices of education Was the Senate to wait till these officers were tried by prevented him from seeing any harm that could arise Court Martial before it gave credence to the President from ships of war bringing home money from the Paci- of the United States? for, Mr. L. said, he considered the fic. The trade there brought much money into the U. documents being communicated to the Senate, a suffiStates. The instructions forbid the Captains, on that cient proof that the President believed them to be true. coast, from bringing home any money but what belongs This evidence sufficiently proved, that the system of to merchants of the United States. You pass this bill, transporting specie had been destructive to the discisaid Mr. S. and it is an interdict. How are your officers pline of the squadron in that quarter. What, then, were to know of the passage of this bill providing against it? they to do? They were, if possible, to prevent a reor how is the President to designate the vessel that is to currence of that system, and, in so doing, they should not be employed? Large sums of money are there belong-pretend to decide on the guilt or innocence of the of ing to merchants. The agents wish to remit it, but the ficers who have commanded on that station. They were Captain who is there may not, under this amendment, told that it was necessary that this practice should be take it, because he is not the Captain designated. We suppressed: therefore, they ought to pass the amendhave a very extensive trade with South America. From ment now proposed. He repeated he meant no reflecthe Middle States we supply them with vast quantities tion on the officers of the Navy generally. He was told of flour in particular. They sell their cargoes at Lima. by his colleague, that, to remove a small evil, a greater Part of the produce of the sale they lay out in copper, one was to be created; that there was a very profitable and the rest they have to send home in specie. But now trade between the United States and the Pacific; that they will be utterly unable to do so, unless the very ves- the returns were made in specie, and it was necessary sel the President has designated happens to be on the that our ships should transport this specie. But he would spot. A great evil will arise from this, because the mer- ask him, where any considerable trade was carried on chants will be compelled to send their money home in with these ports, was there a single dollar brought home unarmed vessels. This will be known, and pirates will in public armed vessels? The trade, said Mr. L. was carlay in wait for, and capture them. If our naval officers ried on in unarmed vessels, and, month after month, do now and then make a little money, by bringing home vessels arrived at Baltimore, bringing home large specie, I, said Mr S. shall be very well pleased. Their amounts in specie-and, if this trade could be carried pay is merely a living, and their obtaining a little money on in safety to Baltimore, it could be carried on to any by these means, does harm to nobody. Your trade in the other ports of the Union, without the intervention of Pacific does not suffer by it. The British allow their public armed vessels. Captains, on the station, to make what they can, and With regard to the transportation of specie from the they not only bring home money for their own mer Pacific, Mr. L. said, it did not often occur that the pubchants, but bring it for any other party that will pay them lie armed vessels brought home much from that part of for it. It consequently has become a drug in England. the world. The money made by transportation did not What we forbid, they take. I spoke lately with an of- result from the home trade, but from carrying money ficer, who informed me that he was requested to bring from port to port in South America. This traffic, Mr. home a sum of about two millions of dollars, but he dare L. contended, was a violation of the laws of nations; not do it; and the British did, and received the premi-our ships of war were converted into insurance offices; um for it. If the officer had been allowed to have done it, he would have made a considerable sum of money, and this quantity of specie would have been introduced into this country, instead of being carried to England. The proposed amendment, Mr. S. thought, would create a great evil to remedy a small one.

Mr. CHANDLER said he had never, before this time, been given to understand that the object of building a

the money of the belligerants was put on board, and our officers received the premiums. This ought certainly to be prohibited. The cupidity of the officers ought not to be suffered to compromise the peace of the nation. Nothing but the weakness of the different powers in that part of the world, had prevented our vessels from being attacked on these very grounds. If England and France were at war, would such a thing be suffered?