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I would like, if you will look for a minute at these charts, to speak of this. I might have gone on to review other things in the data here presented. We have prepared charts which will be presented for your consideration. The issues of physical education, for example, and of teacher training are among possibly the most important of the issues in the development of our public school system in the United States, and it is not overstepping the bounds of a logical argument to say that we have ample evidence of the fact that where the Federal Government has aided, there the States have taken up the problem and gone ahead very much more rapidly than we could have possibly hoped for if we had not had the encouragement and aid which came from the Federal Government. That is peculiarly true in recent years in the case of the development of vocational education. We started with $3,000,000 appropriated by the States. The Federal Government came in with its appropriation of approximately $3,000,000 and within a period of two or hree years the States were appropriating more than $14,000,000.

The case of the colleges of agriculture and of engineering is an outstanding case of the development of a great system of higher education in the United States based almost entirely upon_the encouragement and aid which was originally provided by the Federal Government. Will you look at the second chart, entitled “Relationship of the department of education to other agencies”? This bill provides, in the most certain language that we were able to develop, that the Federal Government, while aiding and encouraging education, while conducting research and investigation in order that education may be improved, shall not interfere with the States in their control and administration of schools. I say that the language is unequivocal. It is made so plain that nobody can possibly put their finger on a word which says that this gives control to the Federal Government. We propose leadership; we propose the bringing together of information on the basis of scientific inquiry that will make for the development of the school system; we propose the kind of cooperation and coordination that is indicated here by a national council of education, and we propose just as certainly that there shall be left to the States and to the communities within the States, the complete control and administration of their schools.

Mr. REED. Doctor, this in no way whatever affects private and parochial schoo's.

Doctor STRAYER. No, sir; it in no way affects private and parochial schoo.s.

Mr. REED. The language is quite explicit on that point, is it not?

Doctor STRAYER. I do not believe anybody could read into this language, at any time, or in any way, anything that would interiere with those schools as they are now.

Mr. REED. That question has been raised, and for that reason I asked you about that.

Doctor STRAYER. The issue is perfectly clear. It says in the bill over and over again that the schools are to be in the control, and to operate under the laws as they now exist in the several States.

Mr. REED. Of course I am familiar with that.
Doctor STRAYER. I know you are.
Mr. REED. But I wanted to bring out that point.

Mr. LOWREY. May I say this; I think the thing that possibly has most militated against this biil has been that a number of the proponents of the bill have made the fight in a way that indicated they were fighting church and private schools; that that was what they were fighting and wanted to down, and that they wanted to put education in the hands of the States. I want to say, further, that if I believed that was to be the result, I would fight the bill to the last, although I want to be understood as being in favor of the bill.

Doctor STRAYER. I can not believe that that would be the result, and I should say, for myself and my colleagues who were responsible for the original drafting of the bill, that not only was that not in our minds, but that we invited the cooperation of those who were responsible for private and church education to sit with us in the discussions in our earliest discussions in the drafting of the measure. The particular provision to which I refer reads as follows, and it occurs after every section (reading]:

All funds apportioned to a State for the removal of illiteracy shall be distributed and administered in accordance with the laws of said State in like manner as the funds provided by State and local authorities for the same purpose, and the State and local educational authorities of said State shall determine the courses of study, plans, and methods for carrying out the purposes of this section within said State in accordance with the laws thereof.

That certainly does not propose to interfere with the situation as it does to-day exist.

Mr. LOWREY. You understand, I was not taking the position that the bill did that, but I wanted to bring that out.

Doctor STRAYER. I am very glad you did.

Mr. LOWREY. In my mind, there is no question that a great deal of the propaganda against the passage of the bill is due to that, that is, the fear of State control of education.

Doctor STRAYER. May I, then, briefly summarize this introductory statement by saying that those responsible for the administration of public education in the United States, with very few exceptions, have over and over again, after discussion and debate, indorsed this measure. It has the support of State, city, and county superintendents of schools.

Mr. Bacon. I have been wondering if that enthusiastic support may not be somewhat due to the provisions of section 9 of this bill?

Doctor STRAYER. I do not remember that section, by the number. It is on page 7 of the bill.

Mr. Bacon. It provides increases in teachers' salaries.

Doctor STRAYER. One may ask, very properly, I think, whether the development of a more efficient system of public education would, after all, receive the support of men interested in public education, and I think the answer always would be yes--anything that is going to contribute to the development of a better and more efficient system of public education.

Mr. Bacon. I did not intend my remark in a critical spirit, but a part of the criticism of this bill is directed to section 9.

Doctor STRAYER. Yes; that may be so.

Mr. Bacon. Which provides for large Federal payments to increase the salaries of local school teachers throughout the country.

Doctor STRAYER. Yes; and how desperately we need to get better teachers will appear later in the hearing.

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Mr. Bacon. That I appreciate. To what do you attribute the failure of the States?

Doctor STRAYER. Well, I think it is not easy to say why any State provides less adequately than it should, for education. I think it is fair to say that some States are very much more able than others to provide. I think it is fair to call attention to the fact that some of the poorer States spend as much as, or even in some cases a larger proportion of their income for education than do, the wealthy States. But just why we have not fully met that responsibility I do not believe I should be prepared to state.

Mr. HOLADAY. Do you and the association which you represent feel that the foreign-born population of our country present a problem that should be dealt with separately?

Doctor STRAYER. Why, separately only in so far as we must organize a special type of education, if we are going to provide for them. You see, it has been necessary to provide a special institution called the high school to do a certain kind of work, to provide special schools called vocational schools to take care of one of the special problems we have in our public-school system, and so on; and it seems to me just as certainly, for a very considerable part of the foreign-born population, it will be necessary, if we are going to do the job, to provide a special type of school. I refer to the fact that in my own city we have some hundreds of thousands of foreign-born people who do not speak English. Now, we can not place them in classes or organize them in schools on the same basis, say, that we provide schools for other people; so that the problem differentiates itself, because we have to provide an unusual or different type of work for them.

Mr. Holaday. One other question, a little bit out of this bill, but I would like to ask the witness, Mr. Chairman.

You are acquainted, I suppose, at least by reputation, with an Italian educator by the name of Papini.

Doctor STRAYER. Yes, sir.

Mr. HOLADAY. Is he to appear at Columbia University in the near future?

Doctor STRAYER. I understand he is to lecture in the summer session.

Mr. HOLADAY. That is all.

Doctor STRAYER. I had said in the presentation of the case, finally, that we are convinced of the possibility of improvement and of development of the public-school system of the United States under the leadership of a department of education. We are convinced, as well, that there is need for encouragement from the Federal Government in order to meet what we know to be certain emergencies which have arisen. We stand on the history of the National Government's participation in education, a splendid history of encouragement, and I have even said, the very foundation upon which our public-school system has been developed.

The CHAIRMAN. May I ask you to elaborate that a little more? I always had an idea that the public schools started locally with the towns.

Doctor STRAYER. I would suggest that Doctor Keith, who is to follow me, knows more about that than any other man I know, and I would like him to talk about that issue.

ton, Va.

Mr. TUCKER. I would like to ask you one question. Do you know anything about the Sims-Eaton School?

Doctor STRAYER. I do not; I am sorry.
Mr. TUCKER. That is a public school founded in 1632 at Hamp-

It was founded by a man who in his will left a farm and six milch cows to establish a free school. That fund still exists. The cows are gone, I suppose, but that fund is still in existence, and so is that school. It has gone through all the wars, Indian and otherwise, and is running to-day. That, I believe, is a little ahead of Harvard, is it not; 1632?

Doctor STRAYER. Yes.
Mr. TUCKER. I thought I would like for you to know about that.
Doctor STRAYER. I am glad to know about it.

Miss WILLIAMS. May I say, Mr. Chairman, at this point, that a recent piece of literature which has been gotten out by the National Education Association says, in very specific terms, that this bill, the Sterling-Reed education bill, in no way interferes with the development of private and parochial schools. We have taken great pains to distribute this bulletin in thousands over the country, to make the case clear as far as we can.

I should like to ask that at this point there be printed in the record the platform of the National Education Association, with its 10 planks, showing the ideals of the educators who have been promoting this idea of the department of education for perhaps 50 years. will show no such motive on the part of the National Education Association; no motive, I mean, of trying to destroy the initiative of, or to cripple in any way, the private and parochial schools.

(The paper referred to is here printed in the record, as follows:)

It

PLATFORM OF THE NATIONAL EDUCATION ASSOCIATION The purpose and object of the said corporation shall be to elevate the character and advance the interests of the profession of teaching and to promote the cause of education in the United States." (Charter of association granted by Congress.)

In carrying out the purpose for which it was chartered, the National Education Association is committed to the following platform:

1. A competent, well-trained teacher, in hearty accord with American ideals, in every public-school position in the United States.

2. Increased facilities for the training of teachers, and such inducements to enter the teaching profession as will attract men and women of the highest character and ability to this important field of public service.

3. Such an awakening of the people to a realization of the importance and value of education as will elevate the profession of teaching to a higher plane in public esteem and insure just compensation, social recognition, and permanent tenure on the basis of efficient service.

4. Continued and thorough investigation of educational problems as the basis for revised educational standards and methods, to the end that the schools may attain greater efficiency and make the largest possible contribution to public welfare.

5. The establishment of a department of education with a secretary in the President's Cabinet, and Federal aid to encourage and assist the States in the promotion of education, with the expresed provision that the management of the public schools shall remain exclusively under State control.

6. The unification and federation of the educational forces of the country in one great professional organization devoted to the advancement of the teaching profession, and, through education, the promotion of the highest welfare of the Nation. To accomplish this purpose every teacher should be a member of a local teachers' organization, a state teachers' association, and the National Education Association.

7. Active assistance to State and local affiliated associations in securing needed legislation and in promoting the interests of such associations and the welfare of their members in accordance with the charter and by-laws of this association.

8. Equal salaries for equal service to all teachers of equivalent training, experience, and success; and the promotion of sympathetic cooperation between school authorities and teachers by utilizing under recognized authority and responsible leadership suggestions and advice based upon classroom experience.

9. Cooperation with other organizations and with men and women of intelligence and vision everywhere who recognize that only through education can be solved many of the serious problems confronting our Nation.

10. The National Education Association is committed to a program of service-service to the teachers, service to the profession, service to the Nation. Its supreme purpose is the welfare of the childhood of America.

NATIONAL EDUCATION ASSOCIATION,

Washington, D. C. Miss WILLIAMS. The next speaker on the program is well prepared to present her own subject. She has been a member of the Council of National Defense; chairman of the committee on Americanization of the National American Woman's Suffrage Association; chairman of the citizenship committee of the National League of Women Voters; chairman of the Americanization department of the Republican State committee, women's division. She now holds the chairmanship of the council of women and children in industry, the State board of labor and industries in Massachusetts. She is chairman of the Americanization division of the Massachusetts League of Women Voters; a member of the legislative committee of the General Federation of Women's Clubs, and vice chairman of the national committee for a department of education. This committee is composed of more than 100 prominent men and women in American life not definitely connected with education, but working for the improvement of public education in this country.

I have the pleasure of presenting Mrs. Frederick P. Bagley, of Massachusetts.

STATEMENT OF MRS. FREDERICK P. BAGLEY, OF BOSTON,

MASS.

Mrs. BAGLEY. Mr. Dallinger and members of the committee, I am very glad, indeed, to have this opportunity of meeting you. I have read over the list of your names many times, during the last two months particularly, and I have wondered how you stood on this bill, and wished that I might have the opportunity of meeting you face to face and of knowing you.

The reason that I have had occasion to read this over so often is that I am the chairman of a subcommittee on women's organizations of the national committee for a department of education, and my job for several years has been a sort of clearing house for women's organizations for information on this bill, and when anybody did not know exactly whom else to apply to for information on this or that on this bill they have written to Mrs. Bagley; and that is the reason that I have had letters from every State represented here, and I have had them day by day coming into my home at the rate of more than a dozen, certainly, a day. That is the reason why I am very glad, indeed, to have this opportunity of meeting you.

I want to say in the first place that I fully appreciate the importance of proposing any further extension of legislation or of expense at this time. We are still a war-burdened people. I realize that, and

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