tary. Those statistics will be sufficiently accurate to compare our coal production with the production of the other countries of the world.

How are we going to ascertain the number of bushels of oats or of wheat or of corn produced in all the States of this Union? That can only be done, I submit to the Senate, by what might be called expert estimates. We are trying in the State of Iowa, in which I live, to ascertain the number of bushels of corn raised in that State during the last year. We have a State statistician, whose duty it is to ascertain that, and who does ascertain it in the the best obtainable way and at the least cost, but whether the production of corn in my State is 250,000,000 bushels or 251,000,000 bushels or 250,000,005 bushels can not be ascertained by any system of statistics that may be presented here or elsewhere.

Take the gold supply. The Senator from Colorado [Mr. Teller] mentioned a moment ago that he was led into a mistake by looking at the Statistical Abstract and finding that it did not exactly agree with the report of the Director of the Mint. While those who compile the Statistical Abstract in the Treasury Department avail themselves of every opportunity, as respects the foreign and domestic commerce and the productions of our country and of other countries, they must, in the very nature of things, avail themselves of the statistical information acquired from other Departments and other Bureaus. So that whoever compiles that Statistical Abstract in the Treasury Department undoubtedly avails himself of the information furnished by the Director of the Mint, who himself is gathering statistics regarding certain things which can be easily and more accurately ascertained by the Director of the Mint than by, probably, any other officer of the Government.

Mr. COCKRELL. He is confined to gold and silver principally.

Mr. ALLISON. His report is confined absolutely to gold and silver; but our Director of the Mint is in correspondence with the directors of all the mints in the world; he is in close correspondence from time to time with the experts in all countries who have information respecting the annual production of gold and silver. It is not necessary for this new statistician of this new bureau to undertake by original processes to ascertain these facts.

So with the Secretary of Agriculture. I do not know that the statistical division of the Agricultural Department gathers all its own statistics, but I do know that its statistics are as reasonably accurate as they can be made; and there is no bureau or department of the Government which can so well and so accurately ascertain the statistics necessary to be inserted in the general volume of our productions as the Department of Agriculture.

So it is that the Statistical Bureau of the Treasury Department now, instead of making original researches on this subject, goes to the Agricultural Department, and embodies in the Annual Abstract the things which the Secretary of Agriculture has been able to ascertain. Therefore, if I want to know the number of bushels of corn or wheat or oats produced I would go to that Statistical Abstract and ascertain it. As now published, it may not be exactly accurate or within a million or two millions of bushels of the total amount produced, but I can ascertain what it is in the aggregate sufficient for any commercial purpose or any industrial purpose.

Then, take another class of information to be sought here and that is brought within the purview of this bill-that is, statistics of transportation. These are all at hand and can be obtained with reasonable accuracy. We have now, in our Interstate Commerce Commission, a special statistician whose duty it is to report annually to Congress the statistics respecting the transportation interests of our country by rail, and these statistics are printed. The general statistician, as contemplated by the Senator from Wisconsin [Mr. Quarles] and provided for in this bill, I now for the first time understand will, of course, seek these resources in order to ascertain these facts. They are well known; they are ascertained without great cost to the Government, and they are accurate because they are transcripts of the statements made by the great railways that transport our products by rail. So it is with our statistics as respects our commerce by sea and the interior rivers and waterways of our country,

Mr. President, I thoroughly agree with the general suggestion that there ought to be, somewhere, a place where these statistics can be collated, compiled, and published in a single volume. I supposed that was already done by the Bureau of Statistics in the Treasury Department, which is proposed by this bill to be transferred. That Annual Abstract is not only an abstract of the receipts of customs, of the amount of imports, and so on, but it embraces the entire range of our products and prices of commodities. The honorable Senator from Wisconsin, the chairman of the Census Committee, proposes to transmute the law that we passed in 1899 into a law permanently estabfishing the Census Bureau, which otherwise would go out of existence by force of the law creating it when its work, which is now in hand, is concluded.

The Senator from Wisconsin, in his most excellent speech, has only confirmed me in the suggestion I made. He is proposing here to bring forward an elaborate scheme, which, if I understand it, I shall give my support to a scheme to make the Census Bureau a permanent one, and a single line, when that comes here, will put it into this new law. If it is wise to put it there, and if we can so arrange this bill as hereafter to provide for all this statistical information to be embodied in this new Department of Commerce rather than in the Department of the Secretary of the Treasury, I shall not object; but I myself do not like to see a suggestion that here it is proposed to consolidate bureaus when in fact there is no consolidation. I look at the various bureaus that would be turned over to this new Department, and I find that the Geological Survey is to be continued under the direction of the Secretary of the Interior. It is just as germane to the operation of that Department as to any other. So I find other things in the bill in the same direction.

Now it is proposed that this new Department shall deal with the foreign commerce of our country, and shall also, from year to year, collect statistics of the industries of our country; and not only so, but that it shall promote our industries, so that it is to be given enlarged powers. I do not object to that, although I think our industries have been fairly well promoted during the last few years by private enterprise and the exercise of judgment as respects these industries by private citizens.

Mr. President, I should not have made these observations but for the fact that I understand the Senator from Wisconsin intends to endeavor to reinsert these provisions. If the Census Bureau is to be provided for by a provision in this bill, it should be inserted with a great many amendments; and I am not sure that I am in favor of the suggestion made by the Senator that this Bureau shall take into its hands the statistics relating to the mining industries of our country and that the Geological Survey shall be denuded of its force, although it has a force now, and a trained force, that has been there for more thar. twenty years. It has at its head one of the most accomplished men in our country as to mining statistics.

Mr. COCKRELL. Dr. Day?

Mr. ALLISON. Dr. Day. I do not know but that if the Director of the Census has the acumen I think he has, he has already availed himself of Dr. Day's skill and force and energy on the subject of mining statistics, because he has them all at hand and has been engaged for twenty years in publishing them in a valuable annual volume.

Mr. QUARLES. That is entirely true, as I understand.

Mr. ALLISON. It seems to me that the suggestion made first by the Senator from Colorado needs careful consideration, and perhaps the bill needs some further amendment. I should like of course, for one, to see some modification in this particular amendment as respects our consular service.

It does seem to me that the only way whereby the statistics of foreign trade, prices, etc., can be ascertained economically is through our consuls and our consuls-general. They are under the State Department. It is true there is a sort of halfway transfer of the jurisdiction of the State Department over these consuls, but it seems to me, in view of the work they have done in the past few years, that it would be wiser for this new Department to avail itself of the work that the Secretary of State is doing in this direction, and then compile in its annual volume whatever information is procured.

Mr. GALLINGER. If the Senator from Iowa will permit me, is not that precisely what is provided for in section 5?

Mr. ALLISON. It may be.

Mr. GALLINGER. It is there provided that

All consular officers of the United States, including consuls-general, consuls, and commercial agents, are hereby required, and it is made a part of their duty, under the direction of the Secretary of State, to gather and compile, from time to time, upon the request of the Secretary of Commerce, useful and material information and statistics in respect to the commerce, industries, and markets of the countries and places to which such consular officers are accredited, etc.

It seems to me this bill takes care of that very clearly and very fully.
Mr. ALLISON. It may.

Mr. LODGE. That portion of the bill, I will say to the Senator from Iowa, was very carefully considered and amended the other day.

Mr. ALLISON. Very well. I merely call attention to it, not that I wish to interfere with it.

Mr. President, I have entered this discussion with hesitation, because I have been absent for some weeks and I have not had an opportunity of giving such attention to the bill as perhaps I should have given it. I am in favor of the establishment of the new Department of Commerce, and I am in favor of giving it whatever jurisdiction such a department should have, but I do not think it is wise at this time, by a single statute, to undertake to change great bureaus of our Government from one

head to another and with that change to change so many officers without due consideration.

I heard with interest the suggestions of the Senator from Minnesota to-day as respects these various bureaus. I think some of them have no more relation to this new Department than they have to the departments with which they are now allied. Mr. Wright, who is now the head of the Department of Labor, has nothing, it seems to me, that should be supervised at all by the head of a department. I think he is doing most excellent work. It is scientific work; it is educational work; it has no special relation to the new Department or to any existing department. So with the Fish Commission. It is a scientific bureau. It is not now under any department, so far as I know. The head of that Commission, I believe, is doing very good work. However, I do not care to discuss this matter further to-night, but I wish to say that if it is the object and purpose of the promoters of this bill, and especially the object and purpose of the honorable Senator from Wisconsin, who is chairman of the Census Committee, to endeavor to gather in under the direction of the census all these various statistical matters, I believe the whole question should be relegated to his bill when it comes in, and if he furnishes a comprehensive method whereby it can be done I shall favor it.

Mr. Teller obtained the floor.

Mr. HOAR. I wish to ask a question, if I may, before the Senator from Colorado proceeds; but I will wait if he would rather proceed. I simply desire to ask

Mr. TELLER. I was going to suggest that the bill would require more discussion, and I have been told that there is a desire to have an executive session.

Mr. GALLINGER. I wish to say that the debate to-day, I think, with the exception of the remarks of the Senator in charge of the bill, has been entirely in the hands of Senators who are not on the Committee on Commerce. I think the bill for that reason ought to go over, and I should myself like a few minutes at some time, being a member of the Committee on Commerce, to make some observations. I am going to try to persuade the distinguished Senator from Missouri, who usually is right, that the amendment he proposes is not necessary.

The consolidation of these statistical bureaus is made absolutely as clear in the bill as it now stands as it will be if the amendment is adopted. However, that is a matter of not very much consequence. I think the bill will have to go over.

Mr. HOAR. Mr. President

Mr. TELLER. I yield to the Senator from Massachusetts, if I have the floor.

Mr. HOAR. I do not wish to take the floor from the Senator.

Mr. GALLINGER. I supposed the Senator from Colorado had concluded his remarks. Mr. TELLER. No.

Mr. HOAR. I merely wished to ask a question which I dare say may have been answered during the debate, as I have been obliged to be absent from the Senate Chamber nearly all the time.

What building or what quarters will be the home of this Department? I suppose some time or other, of course, there will be a new building. I should like to inquire, because we can not tell what may get through the two Houses hereafter, whether the bill should not contain some provision, which it does not now contain, as to the right of the proposed new Department to use rooms until the new building is completed? Perhaps that question has already been answered in debate.

Mr. GALLINGER. It has not been raised.

Mr. HOAR. I should like to ask what is the plan about that. We have certain buildings which by law are appropriated to certain departments of the Government. Now, we create a Secretary, an Assistant Secretary, and some other officials, I believe, and then we say that hereafter certain enumerated Bureaus and officials shall belong to the Department of Commerce. Do they retain by any law their right to remain in the Treasury building, for instance, or in the Interior Department building? Should not the bill have some provision for that? That is the point to which I wish to call attention. I do not wish to interfere at all with my friend's bill.

The discussion in the Senate was resumed on January 22, 1902.

The PRESIDENT pro tempore. The morning business is closed and the Calendar under Rule VIII is in order.

Mr. NELSON. I ask unanimous consent that the senate shall proceed to the consideration of the bill (S. 569) to establish the Department of Commerce.

There being no objection, the Senate, as in Committee of the Whole, resumed the consideration of the bill.

Mr. SPOONER. I should like to ask the Senator from Minnesota if the bill has been reprinted as amended by the Senate? I thought the Senate ordered a reprint. The PRESIDENT pro tempore. It was not ordered, the Chair is informed.

Mr. NELSON. There has been one reprint of the bill. The amendments that were made the last time it was under consideration were very slight. I can explain them

to the Senator.

Mr. QUARLES. I desire to offer an amendment to the bill which has grown out of the discussion we had the other day. I ask the Secretary to read it.

The PRESIDENT pro tempore. One moment, before that is done. This bill having been taken from the Calendar under Rule VIII by unanimous consent, it is subject to the rule limiting debate. Day before yesterday morning the debate went on without limit by general consent. The question is whether the Senate desires the Chair to enforce the five-minute rule. If not, consent should be asked that the rule be waived.

Mr. NELSON. I ask unanimous consent that the rule be waived and that there be no limit to debate.

Mr. HOAR. If we can debate the bill under the five-minute rule, it would hasten the Senator's purpose very much to do so.

Mr. NELSON. I do not feel like cutting off gentlemen who desire to debate the bill, and therefore I ask that it be considered without reference to the rule.

Mr. HOAR. But if no one should desire to speak more than five minutes it would not be necessary to waive the rule.

The PRESIDENT pro tempore. The Senator from Minnesota asks unanimous consent that the limitation of five minutes be waived in the discussion of the bill. Is there objection? The Chair hears none, and it is so ordered.

The Senator from Missouri [Mr. Cockrell] has offered an amendment, which is the pending amendment, and which will be read. The Chair calls the attention of the Senator from Wisconsin [Mr. Quarles] to it.

The SECRETARY. After the word "commerce," in line 4, page 4, section 4, strike out the words "and the chief of said Bureau of Foreign Commerce shall be the assistant chief of the said Bureau of Statistics," and insert:

And the two shall constitute one Bureau, to be called the Bureau of Statistics, with a chief of the Bureau and one assistant.

The PRESIDENT pro tempore. The Senator from Wisconsin [Mr. Quarles] offers an amendment as a substitute for this amendment?

Mr. QUARLES. Yes, sir.

The PRESIDENT pro tempore. It will be read to the Senate.

The SECRETARY. In line 6, page 4, of the printed bill, strike out all after the words "Statistics and" down to and including the words "United States," in line 12, and insert in lieu thereof the following:

That the Secretary of Commerce shall have complete control of the work of gathering and distributing statistical information naturally relating to the subjects confided to his Department; and to this end said Secretary shall have power to employ any or either of the said bureaus and to rearrange such statistical work and to distribute or consolidate the same, as may be deemed desirable in the public interest; and said Secretary shall also have authority to call upon other bureaus or departments of the Government for statistical data and results obtained by them, and it is hereby made the duty of such bureaus or departments to furnish such information when so requested, and said Secretary of Commerce may collate, arrange, and publish such statistical information so obtained in such manner as to him may seem wise.

The PRESIDENT pro tempore. Will the Senator from Wisconsin pardon the Chair for calling his attention to the fact that the Senator from Missouri, who offered the amendment to which this is a substitute, is attending a meeting of the Regents of the Smithsonian Institution and will shortly be here? The Chair suggests that the Senator from Wisconsin withhold his amendment until the Senator from Missouri arrives.

Mr. QUARLES. I comply with great pleasure with the suggestion of the Chair. However, I should like to have as prompt consideration of the amendment as possible.

The PRESIDENT pro tempore. Are there further amendments to be offered to the bill?

Mr. TELLER. Mr. President, it is quite impossible for us in this vicinity to know what is going on. If the purpose is to consolidate these two bureaus, it may be done by the amendment, which I suppose has been adopted; but there is not anyone around in this section of the Senate, I think, who can form any opinion as to what that amendment is.

The PRESIDENT pro tempore. An amendment has just been offered by the Senator

from Wisconsin [Mr. Quarles]. The Chair took the liberty of suggesting to him, as it was a substitute for one offered by the Senator from Missouri [Mr. Cockrell], that the Senator from Missouri is absent as a Regent of the Smithsonian, and will shortly be here, and the Chair suggested that he allow both amendments to lie over until the Senator from Missouri comes in. So nothing has been done with either amendment. Mr. TELLER. I am very glad to know that that is the case, although I think it is a little hard on the Presiding Officer that he shall have to inform us on this side of the Chamber what is going on upon the other side.

Mr. NELSON. Mr. President, I think there is a misapprehension. The amendment of the Senator from Wisconsin [Mr. Quarles] comes in at the end of the amendment proposed by the Senator from Missouri [Mr. Cockrell], and does not conflict with it. The Senator from Missouri proposes to strike out, commencing in line 4, the following words:

And the chief of said Bureau of Foreign Commerce shall be the assistant chief of the said Bureau of Statistics.

And then to insert in place of that the language which I ask the Secretary to read: The Secretary read as follows:

And the two shall constitute one bureau, to be called the Bureau of Statistics, with a chief of the Bureau and one assistant.

Mr. NELSON. That is all. Now, the amendment offered by the Senator from Wisconsin comes in subsequent to that, commencing with the word "and" in line 6, and is supplemental to it. I think there is no conflict between the two, and that the amendment of the Senator from Missouri could well be adopted, leaving the amendment of the Senator from Wisconsin to be acted upon.

The object of the amendment of the Senator from Missouri is to make it perfectly clear that the two bureaus--the one on Foreign Commerce, brought from the State Department, and the Bureau of Statistics, from the Treasury Department-shall be consolidated into one. A question was raised the other day by the Senator from Missouri and the Senator from Colorado [Mr. Teller] as to that point, doubting whether there was a consolidation. The amendment of the Senator from Missouri is to clear up that question, and does not relate to the subsequent amendment of the Senator from Wisconsin.

I am quite content that the amendment of the Senator from Missouri should be adopted, because it is in line with what was intended in the bill originally-to consolidate the two bureaus.

The PRESIDENT pro tempore. Will the Senate agree to the amendment offered by the Senator from Missouri?

The amendment was agreed to.

The PRESIDENT pro tempore. The Senator from Wisconsin [Mr. Quarles] offers an amendment, which will be read.

The SECRETARY. Insert after the amendment just adopted the following:

That the Secretary of Commerce shall have complete control of the work of gathering and distributing statistical information naturally relating to the subjects confided to his Department; and to this end said Secretary shall have power to employ any or either of the said bureaus and to rearrange such statistical work and to distribute or consolidate the same, as may be deemed desirable in the public interest; and said Secretary shall also have authority to call upon other bureaus or departments of the Government for statistical data and results obtained by them, and it is hereby made the duty of such bureaus or departments to furnish such information when so requested, and said Secretary of Commerce may collate, arrange, and publish such statistical information so obtained in such manner as to him may seem wise.

The PRESIDENT pro tempore. Will the Senate agree to the amendment of the Senator from Wisconsin?

Mr. PETTUS. It seems that those two amendments are somewhat inconsistent. One makes the consolidation itself, and the other authorizes the Secretary of Commerce to make it as he may think best.

Mr. QUARLES. It seems to me that my amendment does impinge upon the other, at least slightly. The contemplation of the Senator from Missouri evidently was, in the latter clause of his amendment, to create a bureau to be known as the "Bureau of Statistics." To that extent it would interfere with the more elastic scheme covered by my amendment, which leaves it discretionary with the new Secretary to use these bureaus or to combine or consolidate them as he may deem wise. that respect the Senator from Alabama is right, perhaps.

I think in

Mr. SPOONER. I ask that the section may be read as amended by the amendment of the Senator from Missouri.

The PRESIDENT pro tempore. The Secretary will read that part of the section as already amended, and will then read it as it would stand if amended as proposed by the Senator from Wisconsin.