Mr. LARUE. Mr. Magruder.

Mr. DASH. Now could you describe in as much detail as you can the discussions concerning the political intelligence plan? Did you know it was Mr. Liddy's plan? Did you know that that plan was being proposed by Mr. Liddy?

Mr. LARUE. As I recall there was no reference to Mr. Liddy.

Mr. DASH. When did actually Mr. Magruder and Mr. Mitchell arrive at the discussion of that plan? Was it at the beginning or the end?

Mr. LARUE. This was at the end of the meeting because I had placed this paper at the bottom of the list of proposals that would be discussed.

Mr. DASH. Why did you do that?

Mr. LARUE. Well, there were actually two reasons, Mr. Dash. We did not know if we were going to finish, if we had enough time to finish a discussion on all of these proposals during this meeting. I had, as I indicated, had put them in what I considered priority order and I placed this on the bottom. I discussed this with Mr. Magruder that morning and also indicated to him that I would prefer that the discussion of that paper, if we got to it, would be only in the presence of he, Mr. Mitchell, and myself and that we find some way to excuse Harry Flemming from the meeting.

Mr. DASH. Did you find any way to excuse Harry Flemming from the meeting?

Mr. LARUE. Yes, sir.

Mr. DASH. So he left?

Mr. LARUE. Yes, sir.

Mr. DASH. And there did come a time when you did begin to discuss the so-called intelligence plan?

Mr. LARUE. Yes, sir.

Mr. DASH. Do you recall the budget on that plan?

Mr. LARUE. Pardon me?

Mr. DASH. Do you recall the budget on that plan?

Mr. LARUE. There was a budget attached to that plan; yes, sir.

Mr. DASH. Do you recall the amount of that budget?

Mr. LARUE. No specific amount-to the best of my recollection, it

was several hundred thousand.

Mr. DASH. Would a quarter million, $250,000 be the figure?
Mr. LARUE. I have no specific recollection of that.

Mr. DASH. All right. Could you tell us once that plan was being presented what took place? What did Mr. Mitchell say, what did you say, what did Mr. Magruder say?

Mr. LARUE. As I recall, Mr. Dash, Mr. Magruder, as in the previous proposals, handed this paper to Mr. Mitchell. Mr. Mitchell read it, he asked me if I had read it and I told him I had. He asked me what I thought of it and I told him I did not think it was worth the risk. Mr. DASH. What did Mr. Mitchell say to that?

Mr. LARUE. Mr. Mitchell, to the best of my recollection, said something to the effect that, "Well, this is not something that will have to be decided at this meeting."

Mr. DASH. All right. To your recollection then, Mr. Mitchell did not reject that plan out of hand at that time, did he?

Mr. LARUE. Not to my recollection; no sir.

Mr. DASH. Now, do you know when Mr. Magruder left Key Biscayne?

Mr. LARUE. As I recall this meeting was on March 30, and to the best of my recollection, he left the following day.

Mr. DASH. And therefore there was ample opportunity for Mr. Magruder and Mr. Mitchell to meet together, was there not, between the time that this plan was being discussed in your presence and the time Mr. Magruder left?

Mr. LARUE. Well, I can't state that there was ample opportunity, no sir. That would not be a correct statement, Mr. Dash, because Mr. Magruder left the house in which we were staying, as I recall, you know, sometime shortly after that meeting, and I don't recall Mr. Magruder returning to the house during the time he was in Key Biscayne, and I was at the house all during this time.

Mr. DASH. Do you recall Mr. Mitchell leaving the house?

Mr. LARUE. I do not; no, sir.

Mr. DASH. Would it be possible that he did?

Mr. LARUE. It would certainly be possible, I guess, Mr. Dash, but I have no recollection.

Mr. DASH. Now, during the time that they were in the house together and with you during the meeting, were you in the room at all times?

Mr. LARUE. I could not state definitely that I was in the room at all times, no, sir.

Mr. DASH. You could not state it. As a matter of fact it is quite possible that you were out of the room at certain times.

Mr. LARUE. That is a possibility. I have no recollection of that. Mr. DASH. It is also possible, is it not, that you were on the telephone a number of times?

Mr. LARUE. Pardon me.

Mr. DASH. It is also possible, is it not, that you were on the telephone a number of times?

Mr. LARUE. Yes, sir. However, I would like to state now that there were telephones in the room in which we were holding the meeting.

Mr. DASH. And, therefore, Mr. LARUE, would it be fair to say that you could not state to this committee that at no time while Mr. Magruder was meeting with Mr. Mitchell in Key Biscayne he did not get some indication of approval from Mr. Mitchell concerning this plan? Mr. LARUE. Mr. Dash, I am sorry, I didn't hear your question.

Mr. DASH. Would it be fair, Mr. LaRue to state that you cannot, from your own recollection, tell this committee that at no time while Mr. Magruder was meeting with Mr. Mitchell, in Key Biscayne, that Mr. Mitchell did not approve the so-called Liddy plan or this intelligence plan?

Mr. LARUE. Mr. Dash, I am very sorry, I still don't know if I understand your question.

Mr. DASH. Let me try to simplify that question. I am just trying to have you state to the committee whether you, of your own knowledge, can state to the committee that at no time during the time when Mr. Magruder was down at Key Biscayne that Mr. Mitchell approved or disapproved that intelligence plan.

Mr. LARUE. That is correct.

Mr. DASH. After you left Key Biscayne, did you discuss the Key Biscayne meeting with any of the participants, Mr. Mitchell or Mr. Magruder and at any later time.

Mr. LARUE. Not to my recollection, no, sir.

Mr. DASH. Before, not even after June 17 during the break-in.

Mr. LARUE. Yes, sir; I have had discussions after June 17. I am sorry, I was thinking in the time frame of Key Biscayne to the break

in.

Mr. DASH. Well, with whom did you discuss it after, say, June 17? Mr. LARUE. I have discussed this with Mr. Magruder, I think I have discussed this with Mr. Mitchell.

Mr. DASH. What, if anything, did you say to Mr. Magruder, or did Mr. Magruder say to you about it?

Mr. LARUE. We discussed it, and we had a very obvious difference of opinion as to what happened at the meeting.

Mr. DASH. What did Mr. Magruder tell you and when did he tell you? Can you recall when that discussion took place?

Mr. LARUE. There would have been, I think, in the time period of March or April-April, probably.

Mr. DASH. Of what year?

Mr. LARUE. This year.
Mr. DASH. This year?

Mr. LARUE. Yes, sir.

Mr. DASH. Is that the first time since the Key Biscayne meeting of March 30, 1972, that you discussed this with Mr. Magruder? Mr. LARUE. Yes, I think that is correct.

Mr. DASH. Now, between that March 30 meeting and March or April of this year, the break-in took place at the Democratic National Committee headquarters in Watergate?

Mr. LARUE. That is correct.

Mr. DASH. When that break-in took place, did it occur in your mind that this had some relationship to the plan that had been presented down at Key Biscayne?

Mr. LARUE. Yes, sir.

Mr. DASH. Did you then go to Mr. Magruder and say, "How did this come about?"

Mr. LARUE. I don't recall discussing with Mr. Magruder regarding the conversation or the meeting at Key Biscayne, and I have had several conversations with Mr. Magruder subsequent to the break-in, several aspects of the Watergate-Watergate break-in.

Mr. DASH. As a matter of fact, is this not true, Mr. LaRue, that during June, after the break-in, July, and August, you almost had daily meetings with Mr. Magruder, Mr. Mitchell, Mr. Mardian, and in fact you saw Mr. Magruder quite frequently in the months just after the break-in?

Mr. LARUE. Virtually every day, yes, sir.

Mr. DASH. Yes. And you mean it never occurred to you to ask Mr. Magruder that after that meeting at Key Biscayne, at which you were present, and actually read over the plan the day before, and was present when it was being discussed on March 30, and then the breakin did occur that you didn't raise the question with Mr. Magruder, "How did this come about?"

Mr. LARUE. Yes, sir, I raised the question and speculated with Mr. Magruder on several occasions as to how this came about.

Mr. DASH. Well, then, it is not true that you did not talk to him until March or April but that you discussed this actually during the months of June, July, or August 1972?

Mr. LARUE. After the break-in, yes, sir.

Mr. DASH. And what did Mr. Magruder say to you when you discussed this with him about his role or his participation in the break-in?

Mr. LARUE. Mr. Magruder's conversations with me were reflected in his testimony up here. He told me virtually-told me the same thing that he testified to before this committee as to his role in the break-in. Mr. DASH. In other words, he made a complete confession to you? Mr. LARUE. Yes, sir.

Mr. DASH. Do you know when was the first time he did that? Approximately? I do not want to push you to a date.

Mr. LARUE. I have no specific recollection of dates, Mr. Dash, but I would say in the period of a week or 10 days after the break-in.

Mr. DASH. And did he not, Mr. LaRue, tell you about a phone call that he received from Mr. Colson concerning the so-called Liddy plan? Mr. LARUE. Yes, sir.

Mr. DASH. Could you tell us what he told you about that phone call? Mr. LARUE. As I recall, Mr. Dash, this conversation occurred as a result of speculation that Magruder and I were having on who may be involved or who may have had knowledge of the Watergate break-in. He told me that he had had a call from Mr. Colson, I think sometime in the period of March or April, in which Mr. Colson had asked Mr. Magruder why they could not get an approval on the Liddy budget. Mr. DASH. Did he tell you then or remind you that he understood that you were present at his side, in the room, when he received the phone call from Mr. Colson?

Mr. LARUE. I do not recall any such discussion, no, sir.

Mr. DASH. You know of his testimony before this committee, in which he has testified that you were in the room?

Mr. LARUE. Yes, sir, I am aware of that. My recollection is as I have just stated.

Mr. DASH. Now, when you state that Mr. Magruder told you everything, it was about a week or so after the break-in. Was anybody else present when he said that to you or told you about this?

Mr. LARUE. Not that I recall. As I recall, it had been a discussion between just Mr. Magruder and I.

Mr. DASH. Now, Mr. LaRue, when and where did you actually first hear about the June 17 break-in matter?

Mr. LARUE. At the Beverly Hills Hotel in Los Angeles, Calif.
Mr. DASH. Were you with anybody else at that time?

Mr. LARUE. Yes, sir, we were on a trip. Present were Mr. Mitchell, Mr. Magruder, Mr. Mardian, Mr. Porter, I think Mr. Caldera from the committee. I mean these were the people who were present from the reelection committee.

Mr. DASH. Now, can you tell the committee as clearly as you can recall, how that news came to you, who first learned about it and how you learned about it, and what was done?

Mr. LARUE. As I recall, Mr. Dash, we were having breakfast on-I think Saturday morning-I guess that would be June 17. Mr. Magruder was paged, went to the telephone. He came back to the table

and said that he had had a rather unusual, strange call from Gordon Liddy, who wanted him to go to some, as I recall, some NASA installation or NASA base in Los Angeles, where there was a secure phone, and to use this phone to call back to Mr. Liddy in Washington.

Mr. DASH. Did Mr. Magruder say anything about what the problem was? Do you recall the words as nearly as possible?

Mr. LARUE. Well, he indicated that Mr. Liddy-he said Mr. Liddy indicated that there was a problem he wanted to discuss and Mr. Magruder, in an aside to me, said that, you know, I think maybe last night was the night they were going into the Democratic National Committee.

Mr. DASH. Did that mean anything to you when he said that?

Mr. LARUE. Well, specifically, no, but it, in view of the fact that I was aware of this plan that had been discussed in Key Biscayne, it certainly aroused a great curiosity or interest on my part, yes, sir.

Mr. DASH. Now, what followed? Mr. Magruder then went ahead and spoke to Mr. Liddy?

Mr. LARUE. I think I told Mr. Magruder that, why didn't he just go and use a pay phone, that that would probably be secure enough for the purposes.

Mr. DASH. What did he do?

Mr. LARUE. He called Mr. Liddy back and then came back and told me that Liddy had told him that there had been a break-in at the Democratic National Committee; I think five people had been caught inside, and that one of the people was Mr. McCord, who was our security man at the reelection committee.

Mr. DASH. Now, was that information relayed to Mr. Mitchell?
Mr. LARUE. Yes; I personally relayed that to Mr. Mitchell.
Mr. DASH. What was Mr. Mitchell's reaction?

Mr. LARUE. I had gotten Mr. Mitchell out of another meeting. We went into an adjoining room. I relayed this information to Mr. Mitchell. He was very surprised. I think as I recall, he made the statement, "That is incredible."

Mr. DASH. Now, did Mr. Mitchell give any instructions to anybody after getting that information?

Mr. LARUE. Not at that time. As I recall, Mr. Mitchell went back into his meeting. Then later on, I think Mr. Magruder and I and Mr. Mitchell met and, yes, Mr. Mitchell asked that someone call Mr. Liddy and have him contact Mr. Kleindienst, the Attorney General, and have Mr. Kleindienst get in touch with Chief Wilson and see what details we could find out about this situation.

Mr. DASH. Now, was anything else done to your knowledge, while you were out in California, concerning the break-in?

Mr. LARUE. Well, yes, there was a-Mr. Mitchell issued a press statement on the instant-I think that was Saturday afternoon. Mr. DASH. Anvthing else?

Mr. LARUE. Well, there were several telephone calls made back and forth from Washington to-I mean, from Los Angeles to Washington, to our press office here.

Mr. DASH. I take it there was quite a commotion.

Mr. LARUE. Yes, sir.

Mr. DASH. Now, you returned. When did you return to Washington from California?